why ground an alarm panel.

I haven't left my pulpit yet either; just letting the steam build up before I unleash another blast of hot air....:)))

RHC

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?

Yeh, it is kind of funny.

He can't keep his mouth shut and I won't let him get away with making snotty remarks to or about me with out making some about him. If his IGNORING policy was what he really believed it to be ......... all of this would never be happening. How come it ignoring doesn't apply here? How come he thinks others should do it and he doesn't?

But ............... who cares?

He makes it what it is.

Um, lessee...YOU maybe? That's obvious. Nah. Never about you....right?

Time fer your nap, dad. js

Ahhh, the controversy continues.

Lightning will always look for the path of least resistance to ground. If you do not provide a path with a ground connection, then it may find one through current sensitive devices such as door contacts. I would rather have a positive indication of a lightning strike (extra service revenue) and replace a fried panel than trying to figure out what other devices went bad in a floating system; or worse yet have a burglary miss due to a frozen contact from a lighting surge. Most reed contacts when hit by lightning will weld closed, thereby not providing an open on alarm. Make sure to check ALL window/door contacts when there is any suspicion of a lightning surge. This is another reason for dealers to provide annual inspections to your customers.

Also remember that if you do ground systems, you must check ground rods as in sandy areas such as Florida the rods can glass-over from lighting surges, thereby creating a glass insulator. I would like to see a panel someday that did a reference ground check to make sure the ground rod was still good. How many out there meggar old ground rods? Zero......

Also, remember that the manufacuter's installation instructions call for a ground to be made. If for some reason you have a performance liability issue down the road with the install, this could come into play since you did not follow the manufacturer's guidelines for doing a correct installation. I know there are many reasons to 'float' a ground connection on an alarm and many have proven that the risk of damage to the panel is less; however some may want to think of the issues mentioned above. There is a good reason why the ground lug is provided on alarm panels.

BobbyD

aut>Hi,

Same to you Mike.... "mikey" a écrit dans le message de news: dp447a$oas$ snipped-for-privacy@domitilla.aioe.org...

Not gonna happen you fat bald headed prick.]

You started it, I'll finish it.

Oh yeah. Almost forgot.

Fuck you and yours for the New year.

Yeh....... I'll bet you've got a really nice stroke. You ol tonsil tickler you.

Fuck you, you big ol fat cocksucker you.

Time for you to suck another dick ...... isn't it?

Uh-huh... Its "current state" is much improved over its old one... IMO.

When are you going to get around to fixing the pop-up/pop-under problem at bassburglaralarm.con? You still have your "Pine View Circle" address listed on it as well... I take it Ms. Combs doesn't mind getting your mail, etc. Tsk!!

This part of the business falls on deaf ears Bob. Very seldom do alot of these installers think about potential liability issues. One law suit would sink the majority of the small companies in this country. I would bet that most are under insured, if they even have the proper insurance at all, their service records are neatly cataloged on the dashboard of their truck (a few coffee stains don't matter), and they would have to look in the yellow pages for an attorney if and when that time comes. "Proactive rather than reactive". It is interesting how this philosophy runs true, from the installation methods through to the administrative functions of the company.

It also seems to hold true from a marketing perspective. I doubt there is one in ten small companies that have an actual marketing plan written down to guide them over the years. Most seem to fly by the seat of their pants, simply copying the industry norms and procedures, whether those apply equally well to large and small companies or not. This leaves them open to be drawn away from their companies "core values", sometimes into losing propositions.

It's all very well to stay flexible as you should, but being diverted away from your thought out marketing plan can lead quickly into unprofitable markets. As an old professor said to me once.." you can't get where you want to go unless you know where that actually is, and precisely how to get there"...

RHC

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?

People often worry about liability issues, but I just don't see it as a problem -- assuming you have good contracts and errors and omissions insurance. You seem to be saying that most small companies have neither. That would be an interesting survey for someone to take. I wonder if it's true?

After all, it's not like you see million dollar judgments being handed down against alarm companies very often.

- badenov

a panel is "technically superior", it's also not required by law.

From the FA 168CPS Installation Manual:

"This product has been designed and laboratory tested to ensure its resistance to damage from generally expected levels of lightning and electrical discharge, land does not normally require an earth ground."

It goes on to say that if you want to ground it they recommend cold water pipes or electrical outlets....

Grounding to a water pipe is no longer acceptable. Any wire that connects to a pipe is for bonding - to remove electricity from that pipe for human safety. Once, water pipe grounding was acceptable. Grounding to pipes is no longer acceptable. Which then raises more doubts about what that author considers acceptable - including what is and is not acceptable lightning damage. What was acceptable back when one could ground to water pipes is no longer reliable today.

Questions his numbers. What numbers were acceptable to that author who is also advocating what is now unacceptable grounding to water pipes? It also raises another question. Do you only meet acceptable reliability standards? Or do you want to exceed those standards by grounding the panel? A so simple and inexpensive connection to ground that increases reliability? Some only want to meet standards. Others exceed them when doing so is so easy.

Aga> "This product has been designed and laboratory tested to ensure its

In all probability the installation manual mentioned by Joe was written long before code changes regarding grounding took effect. The manufacturer might not be inclined to revise the installation manual if the product is already UL listed. Doing so would require resubmission of the manual to UL -- an expensive and time consuming exercise. The existence of manuals with outdated techniques does not alter the fact that water pipe grounding is no longer an acceptable practice.

Regards, Robert L Bass

Are you saying the installation manual is "UL Listed"??? Like the "help" manual you "designed" for Edward's?? I may not be from Missouri... But "show me" anyways!!