Nice try Robert. Your last response in the "free estimate" thread needs some medication. Hopefully it isn't contagious. My "IT" person will be in Tuesday and I will find out. If you sent some sort of virus, and after our latest communications, I will only suspect you did it intentionally. Up until this point, there has been no damages, other than maybe some high blood pressure on your part. Hopefully, you didn't start something you will regret.
To answer your question from the "free estimate" thread, you have not posted the part of the statute that pertains to why you think you are exempt from your extra curricular business activities which are above and beyond internet sales.
(5) The sale or installation of any finished products, materials, or articles of merchandise which are not actually fabricated into, and do not become a permanent fixed part of, the structure. This subsection shall not be construed to limit the exemptions provided in subsection (6).
SEEMS THAT WHAT RLB IS SELLING DOES BECOME A :FIXED PART OF THE STRUCTURE" SO EXEMPTION DOES NOT APPLY.
489.505 Definitions.--As used in this part:
(2) "Alarm system contractor" means a person whose business includes the execution of contracts requiring the ability, experience, science, knowledge, and skill to lay out, fabricate, install, maintain, alter, repair, monitor, inspect, replace, or service alarm systems for compensation, including, but not limited to, all types of alarm systems for all purposes.
DOES A DIY KNOW HOW TO DO THESE THINGS WITHOUT RLB HELP?
25) "Burglar alarm system agent" means a person:
(c) Whose specific duties include any of the following: altering, installing, maintaining, moving, repairing, replacing, servicing, selling, or monitoring an intrusion or burglar alarm system for compensation.
NOTE "SELLING" ABOVE AND BELOW
(28) "Fire alarm system agent" means a person:
c) Whose specific duties include any of the following: altering, installing, maintaining, moving, repairing, replacing, servicing, selling, or monitoring a fire alarm system for compensation.
(1) Any person engaged in the business of contracting in the state shall be registered in the proper classification unless he or she is certified. Any person desiring to be a registered contractor shall apply to the department for registration and must:
489.518 Alarm system agents.--
(1) A licensed electrical or alarm system contractor may not employ a person to perform the duties of a burglar alarm system agent unless the person:
b) Has successfully completed a minimum of 14 hours of training, to include basic alarm system electronics in addition to related training including CCTV and access control training, with at least 2 hours of training in the prevention of false alarms. Such training shall be from a board-approved provider, and the employee or applicant for employment shall provide proof of successful completion to the licensed employer. The board shall by rule establish criteria for the approval of training courses and providers and may by rule establish criteria for accepting alternative nonclassroom education on an hour-for-hour basis. The board shall approve providers that conduct training in other than the English language. The board shall establish a fee for the approval of training providers or courses, not to exceed $60. Qualified employers may conduct training classes for their employees, with board approval.
489.5185 Fire alarm system agents.--
(b) Has successfully completed a minimum of 14 hours of initial training, to include basic fire alarm system technology in addition to related training in National Fire Protection Association (NFPA) codes and standards and access control training, with at least 2 hours of training in the prevention of false alarms. Such training must be from a board-approved provider, and the employee or applicant for employment must provide proof of successful completion to the licensed employer. The board, by rule, shall establish criteria for the approval of training courses and providers. The board shall approve qualified providers that conduct training in other than the English language. The board shall establish a fee for the approval of training providers, not to exceed $200, and a fee for the approval of courses at $25 per credit hour, not to exceed $100 per course.
489.531 Prohibitions; penalties.--
(1) A person may not:
(a) Practice contracting unless the person is certified or registered;
(f) Knowingly give false or forged evidence to the department, the board, or a member thereof;
h) Conceal information relative to violations of this part;
j) Willfully or deliberately disregard or violate any municipal or county ordinance relating to uncertified or unregistered contractors.
THEN THERE IS THE PART ABOUT POSTING YOU LICENSE NUMBER ON YOUR WEBSITE. AND WHAT ABOUT THE PART ABOUT NOT COMPLETING CONTRACTS PAID FOR? SOME OF THOSE BBB COMPLAINTS COULD BE CONSTRUED AS UNFINISHED CONTRACTS.
Yada, yada, yada... This debate has been going on for years. I looked at the Florida statutes a couple of years back to see what the deal is. Bottom line is that you need a license if you are paid to actually install wiring in a house or business. Otherwise you are in the same legal space as the sales associate at Radio Shack or Home Depot. The various threats from posters to get the state of Florida involved in these statute "violations" always turns out to be a lot of hot air. Your "IT" person is going to give you a look that you should remember for future reference. ;)
It always amazes me how little it takes to get them started and how little they say once they get started. I wonder if they are Irish like me. If so they are living up to that old saying "you can always tell an Irishman, but you can't tell him much". If they like to talk lawyer this much in real life, then it is no wonder some are living in more humble accommodations. They are too busy making certain that their respective lawyers are the ones living high on the hog. I couldn't imagine the look on my lawyer's face if I told him I wanted to take some sort of legal action based on this nonsense. I am sure I'd get tossed out of his office (after paying the bill) and asked not to return. It does all get tiresome, but when things are really dull it can make you chuckle; especially if you let your imagination put the scene into focus as each is banging away on the keyboard just snot slinging mad.
If anything is being done is against the law, it would have been stopped by the state of Florida years ago per all the hot air "I'm calling the law!" post that have been made. Most of those that post here and consider themselves 'in the trade' also apparently think they are a cross between a CIA agent and Batman. ;)
cute. no comment on the facts though, eh? specifically the exemption part that obviously doesn't apply or maybe you are not as smart as you would like us to believe so instead you prefer bulls... and insults?
When did I say I was smart? What little I have learned it has always been the hard way. My lawyers always tell me that the facts of a case are decided by a jury and the law by a judge. I am neither. I am smart enough to know that I don't know the answer to your question(s). If I did want to know I think I might go about it differently, perhaps by posting a complaint to the proper authorities and seeing what reply I got. If that answer was not satisfying I might try having my attorney write a letter to get more action. Asking what my feelings are or aren't certainly isn't going to resolve anything. I am nobody and my opinions mean nothing, especially since I don't even live in Florida. To my way of thinking the techniques of using either a straw poll or consensus discussion on an NG to answer the question seems the least likely to shed any light on the matter, only heat. Since this has been going on unresolved for so long it seems that heat is the goal for it all and not light. In addition to being Mister Vermin for reading it all, you can add Mister perverse for getting a chuckle out of all of it. Lately I have become Mister Bored for reading it all over again via new posts with the same old message. Merry Christmas!
sorry to bore you and I'm not trying to get anybody to join in. bAss posted the statutes and requested someone show where he is violating them. I did. I like your stories though.
gotta admit though for a bunch of people that doesn't want to talk about it you all sure do talk about it a bunch. to paraphrase another poster that you don't want to talk about; "i'm gonna do what i"m gonna do and there is nothing you or anyone else can do about it" merry christmas
Post the links to the applicable statutes that were changed in
2006 and I'll see if there is a significant difference from the old ones. In the past posters were basing their post on their own "fanticy thinking" and not what was actually written in the statutes.
Correction, Tom. All this crap about lying on the application was just something Sabodish made up. In fact I told them the entire truth (much more than anyone here knows). I attached extra paper to my application. They looked at it all, decided that past problems were unrelated to the trade and gave me permission to take the exam.
A short time before I moved to Florida Sabodish tried the same crap that Mugford's pals did. His nonsesne was even easier to deal with than theirs. I spoke to the CT agent by phone, told him about Sabodish's hate website and this newsgroup. He browsed both, saw that Sabodish is a nutcase and dismissed it.
I checked the 20056 statute. Retailers who don't install are still not required to have a Florida electrical license. Nothing pertaining to businesses like mine has been changed.
Dear Jack: Thank you for the warm holiday greetings but I must correct you. It's not officially Christmas until you've watched A Christmas Story for 48 hours straight.
Cabling-Design.com Forums website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.