Florida Statute According to RLB

Wow... And what Web Browser did you use to do that?? Dang!! I'll bet you even the lottery numbers for next Friday's draw!!! :-)

Actually, he didn't. At least according to the info at "you know where"...

I agree. For one thing I think he would enjoy far more success if he had someone really professional design his site... It isn't very user friendly, relies on "alarm speak" because it's primarily a "cut and paste" job from various manufacturer's websites, and he changes the phone numbers more often than I do my undies (the last bit is a blatant exaggeration).

I was wondering where all that came from... That just "stinks", Tom. Bass has frequently attacked me in the Group (and even gone "real life"), but I've never resorted to this tactic. I did file a formal complaint at the "MyFlorida" website, but they apparently never received it due to some "glitch" in the coding which they've since corrected. I never re-filed because at that point, Bass' online behaviour was enough to make any potential customer tuck tail and run. It hasn't improved all that much since. These days all I'm asking is that he provides proof for the more outlandish things he says... I can't remember the last time I posted his BBB report...

Gag!! P-t-oo-ie! Thanks a lot!! Now I've gotta go wash my mouth out with Lysol and sandpaper my tongue.

And to you!!

rlb posted the entire statute and challenged someone to read it and point out where he is sideways with it. So I then I picked out the relevant sections and posted them as per his request. see above post in this thread dated 12/22 6:44pm. for entire statute see post from rlb 12/22/06 @ 3:37 PM to the "free estimate" thread. or

what's terrific news?

never said I did.

you seem confused.

from you? how would I know?

When ever someone finishes training the kangaroos to be able to sit in chairs for hours at a time.

I remember trying to lick something on the back of the bus.

489.105 (3) specifically states that a "contractor" is a person who has *contracted* for a project for *compensation*. No contract, not a contractor. No compenastion, not a contractor. If a person is not a contractor per the definition of a contractor, then the person probably does not need licensure under this statute. Why not give an attorney $100 to get his read on this. You can post up what the attorney says and prove your position. 489.105 Definitions.--As used in this part:

(3) "Contractor" means the person who is qualified for, and shall only be responsible for, the project contracted for and means, except as exempted in this part, the person who, for compensation, undertakes to, submits a bid to, or does himself or herself or by others construct, repair, alter, remodel, add to, demolish, subtract from, or improve any building or structure, including related improvements to real estate, for others or for resale to others; and whose job scope is substantially similar to the job scope described in one of the subsequent paragraphs of this subsection. For the purposes of regulation under this part, "demolish" applies only to demolition of steel tanks over 50 feet in height; towers over 50 feet in height; other structures over

50 feet in height, other than buildings or residences over three stories tall; and buildings or residences over three stories tall. Contractors are subdivided into two divisions, Division I, consisting of those contractors defined in paragraphs (a)-(c), and Division II, consisting of those contractors defined in paragraphs (d)-(q):

What I meant by my response was that he didn't lie on his app. You say he did.

Who am I to say as well? But if he's "making a buck", then why not spend it where it really counts? He's obviously "obsessed" with "positioning" but I seriously doubt this Newsgroup represents even a small "fraction" of a percentage point in "new business" for him. The only reason he's here is to rattle a few cages. Even the guys in CHA have never included his site in their many referrals. It's been obvious to me that he's nothing more than a "blowhard", installer "wannabe" with a lot of time on his hands and no life. I object to his personal attacks and will continue to ask for proof of what he says about me (or anyone else).

I don't find "libel" or besmirching someone's character the least bit "comical".

Heh... "advertises"... right...

Nope. I'm not askin' for him to provide anything on himself anymore. That's a fairly useless venture. Besides, I've already concluded everything I need to know about his "experience" (as have a number of others).

I figure my just asking (and his non-response) is enough for people to be able to flag his "statements" as completely false and misleading.

Not interested. If I ever fly down to Florida it'll be to visit "the Cape", and Disney World. I'm not interested in seeing some pink "cue" ball.

Considering what he's doing here and the supposed "business" he derives from it, it's only fair for him to "come clean". It's what my customers would expect from me. Verifiable proof of my knowledge and expertise. It's no different than giving someone references. You are right, though... It is gettin' a little "lame". Sort of like beating a dead fish with a stick.

I don't sell anything here and if I did, I certainly would post that info. I actually derive some amusement from the whole "Daffy Holmes" efforts he's made to try and locate me.

Check.

Yeah. I've gotta get more witty reposts goin'. You're hoggin' all the limelight at the moment.

Check.

So with all of us involved it'd be "Brokeback Goofy".

I've no interest in "harming" Bass, his business, or his family.

Gee, would you? NOT!!!

Now that's something you'll get no argument on! :-)

You are in the wrong Part of the State Statute. Your quotes are coming from

489 Part I. That does not apply to the statute that governs our >

you can lead a horse to water........

Ya know Tom, that is exactly what I do when RBL comes off with his holier than crap attitude

I don't start it and I am guilty of not dropping it. I guess it is time to keep it all silent.

Where did his monitoring ventures go right after the State visited him? Never mind, he stopped so that is the end of that.

So then what you are saying is he is not beyond ducking the law the minute he thinks he might have a problem. Nice! I guess that is the difference between a parts reseller and a security professional.

Regardless of the things that go on here, his antics don't equal a pimple on a knats ass compared to what goes on in this state. Actually the state would waste a nickel on him. Now if a consumer complained, it would be a different issue. Sorta like what got the "free" deal shut down. That is why his BBB report may be more threatening to him than anything in the licensing statute. Remember the land scams that made Florida famous back in the 60's and 70's. Backfired though. I wish I would have been scammed back then. That land turned into being worth millions.

No problem. He can run rampant on this group and throw insults at anyone he chooses on any particular day. It is all kicks and giggles to me anyway. I can find other sources of amusement.

I have never went real life on RBL other than posting in this group. I do find out about things, knowledge is power, but I have never gone beyond that. I asked questions and people have no problem giving me answers. Not a bad thing to be able to do.

Olympics luge event.

Kicks and Giggles. Sorry it is boring. I guess I just have a dry since of humor.

That is true. Go on the net, find a part to purchase, give a credit card number, receive it by UPS. No license required. That is absolutely true. So let me be the first to say it, RBL does not need a license to sell parts over the internet. There, I have said it. Now, what about the telephone sales he bragged about, with the hiring of sales people, a while back? It is not important and I really don't give a rat's ass, but he can not say that, if he is actually doing this, that he is only doing internet sales, now can he? Since the law changed in July and dropped the word "on-site", which he most recently posted as his out, does require a license for telephone sales. The sales people don't need to be licensed, however they need to be registered as Burglar Alarm Systems Agents and if they sell fire product they also need to be Fire Alarm Systems Agents. This requires education, backgrounds every two years, fingerprints and drug screening. End of story and I promise to not post it again.

Where?

There were some things RBL was hanging his hat on. The statute is legislatively looked every year and changed as the times change. If you read them five years ago, they are not the same. A word change here and there changes the interpetation.

Can't complain without proof. Besides, the state has a hard time with competitors complaining against other competitors. Whether you are or you aren't a competitor, the state would look at it that way, especially if you didn't have proof.

Yeah and he tried to squash the sale of monitoring to Florida residents to stay within the law as far as needing a license to do so. Being in Florida and entering into contracts for compensation even though the client was outside of Florida is where the interpetation of the Statute was unclear between the two State attorneys when RBL was investigated. He decided to quit altogether AFAIK.

Goes without saying even though he will say if he needed one he would go get one. Of course I would say he can't and he would call me a worthless liar, blah blah blah.

Actually, it is more like they really don't give a crap about his antics. He is to small of a fish to fry. I know that. Why do you think, with all my quoteing statute do you think I have never filed a complaint? He is so easy, if I wanted to I could get any proof I needed. A vendictive person, which I am not, could get to him because his ego puts him at danger of being set up. I am not going to waste the States time and money. I gotta work with these people and regardless of what RBL thinks, I do have a good reputation with these folks. I just like giving him high blood pressure about his dealings when he knows I am right. Do you think he is stupid enough to admit publically that he is wrong?

We could start on the County Revenue Department or Florida sales tax audits, but that might be to boring as well. Wouldn't want to be accused of going real life either.

Bottom line is that what ever RBL posts does not in anyway shape or form effect me. He simply doesn't like that I use his shortcomings for my own amusement. He throws out his childish insults, which are redundant, as he has used them all on OP going back to when I was just lurking around here. So, sorry to have bored you. Have a Happy New Year.

You understand it, I understand it, they good folks in Florida, that have to live by it, understand it and then there are those that understand it but choose to ignore it. They just know they can't admit it. Email me.

I responded to the statute that was being quoted by the poster. Apparently you are easily confused and are having a loss of focus. Post the link to the statute you are having issus with. I would assume you are concerned with either alarm system installation or the sale of alarm services. As far as installation is concerned, in the past if a person is not actually installing wiring in a structure, a license is not needed. Post your link. Again, why don't you notify the Florida law enforcement to resolve your issue?. ;)

the link has been posted by me and the entire statute posted by rlb. see part II ELECTRICAL AND ALARM SYSTEM CONTRACTING sections 489.501-489.538. oh never mind. if you can't even find it after being led. oh never mind

The point is :

If you ignore the nasty son of a bitch it condones what he does.

His life is wrong. His business practices and morals are wrong. His attitude to and about anyone who disagrees with him, is wrong. His arrogance is wrong.

Silence says that what he does and what he represents is acceptable behavior in this Newsgroup or anywhere.

Objection to his unacceptable conduct says there are people with integrity who care that others are not duped by the likes of this malignant piece of shit. That people who are right prevail and not the other way around. That people should not be treated disrespectfully for self serving reasons. And to show that there are consequences for acting that way.

Will it stop him? No, not unless he has an epiphany before he croaks, shortly. But don't hold your breath. In his sick mind he's totally committed to making everyone believe that he's convinced that he's right. And besides, what does he have to lose? At this point, he's dead and so it makes no difference to him. He'll like the thought, I'm sure, of going out, leaving the impression that he never gave up his pleasure of antagonistic conduct. That will override any thoughts that he might have of how many people in this world immensely dislike him and do not, ......will not .....and will never .... approve of people like him.

He's a misfit. Take a look at his life and his message he's left in Usenet. It can't be changed and that message will stand for itself.

As far as I'm concerned, my message will also stand. I do not approve of him, his life, his conduct, his arrogance, his disrespect for people, simply because it's wrong. He deserves no better treatment in return, which I will continue to do.

In the face of the behavior of this malicious, spiteful and vicious son of bitch, those of you who remain silent also leave your message.

The Florida statutes debate is so played out. The people posting them are always saying "well I wouldn't file a complaint but if I did" Well if they're not going to file the complaint then quit wasting our f****ng time talking about what would happen if they did.

"Si Ballenger" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@news.comporium.net...

Si,

The State Statute that govern alarm system activities is F.S. Chapter 489 Part II, as well as, a Rules Chapter, which I will let RLB find for himself and a Florida Administrative Code Chapter of the Florida Statutes. There is also the Uniform Building Code and Florida Fire Pervention Code and the State Fire Marshals Statute. These are also enforced by the Electrical Contractors Licensing Board of the Department of Business and Professional Regulation along with interrelated Regulatory Agencies like the Department of State, Department of Financial Services, the IRS, and the State Department of Revenue.You quoted out of Chapter 489 Part I. This is the statute that is governed by the Contractors Industry Licencing Board. Although they are a State board, they are not even located in Tallahassee. They are located in Jacksonville, FL. The CLIB is the board that handles all other trades, ie plumbers, roofers, AC contractors, etc. They have nothing to do with electrical or low voltage. Alarm contracting is very well defined in the proper statute.

Not when I have been involved legislatively over the last nine years to craft the statute as it is written today and to teach the statute to the state investigators, as to how it pertains to our industry. Those that skim read, don't deal with the Attorney General's office, think they are above the law, and don't keep up with the changes after the legislative session is over are the ones to be easily confused.

I

I am not concerned with any of it. People here seem to have missed the boat if they think I give a rat's ass about RBL's activity. I simply point out he is wrong in his thinking. He can't agree without admitting he is wrong. That is not in his personality. Most that want to do things properly will ask questions, get references, do some homework as things do change. He is in a state of denial.

As far as

Wrong. The state law, dealing with alarms, came into effect back in the mid

80's and always included more than just installation. In fact, it started out to be under the same statute as the security guards. Then it looked like it would fall under the Board of Insurance and the State Fire Marshall's Office, and at one time looked like the Secretary of State Office was going to take it. It ended up were it should be and that is with the DBPR and the ECLB. In 489 Part II, you will find that it says, whose business includes the "ability", "experience" "science", and "skill" to "lay out", (all of which RBL claims) fabricate, install, maintain, alter (which he does through downloading), repair, monitor (which he was entering into contracts to do right up to the time he was investigated), inspect, replace, or service for compensation (which he claims is free but we all know nothing is free). It is not limited to installing wire in a structure. See the word "inspect"? Do you know that UL was required to get a license in florida last year to do their inspections? They were required to and they did. We worked out language in the law this year to exempt them when with a licensed person on their inspections. The statute covers more than installations. You will also find references to "design" in compliance with the law (code)(does he do this with his clients?). You will also see where there is language that pertains to the term contractor engaging in business under an express or implied contract that undertakes, offers to undertake, purports to have the capacity to to undertake. If you read it through, you will also read where it talks about those that are performing duties, that will constitute contracting, which are similar to those previously listed but include sales. It once said on-site sales, but the on-site term was removed.(he even admitted, just recently, that the reason he didn't need a license is because he didn't go the clients home, so now what is his reason since the on-site thing is gone) The problem that most have when they read things like this is the word contractor. They think you must have a tool belt on to be one. In reality it is anyone entering into a contract for compensation. Contract-Contract(or) Is a contract just for installation, or can it be for a design, lay out? Does the word alter in the statute pertain to moving a motion or do you think it just might also include programming. (Just for info. the state already issued a ceased and desist on an unlicensed person doing that, of course RLB will call me a liar). Does a contact have to be expressed or can it be implied? If RLB actually did go into the telephone marketing thing, I could go into the whole definition of subcontracting and/or employee relationship thing, the part of the statute that requires workers comp insurance, new employee hiring notification, registering with the state, which would require a license anyway for the type business, the whole corporation filing with partners, directors, qualifing agents, notification of address changes etc. But I won't because I don't know if that was just more RBL ego talk. The statute(s) and rules go on. But others are right, its boring, and again I just do it to bust his ego a bit.

Again, why don't you notify the Florida

Because I don't have an issue. I really don't give two hoots. I just think he needs to be outed when he climbs up on his pedistal. Read the statute. I am sure you will say, yep, there just might be something here after all. But than again, does anyone really care? The general consenses is to drop it, so I will only post about it if ever asked.

I really didn't think much would get pass you Tom, but obviously the intent of all this, and the debates on this topic in the past, has. That's is OK, you made your point and I heard it. I guess a couple of bucks bought him some kindness from you for a little while. How long will that last?

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