Whew! pretty long dry spell here is ASA

YUP!! That is the real Magic Rule!! It is sad that others don't understand and use it.

Les

As an extra side note. Don't you wish that the Medical Profession would view you as a Customer as opposed to a Patient?? If they did maybe the Customer would not have to be overly Patient!!

Did you ever wonder why when you are going to see a doctor you are considered a Patient as opposed to a customer or client?? Could it be that the meaning of the same word got twisted somehow??

According to Wikipedia: Etymology. The word patient originally meant 'one who suffers'. This English noun comes from the Latin word patiens, the present participle of the deponent verb, patior, meaning 'I am suffering,' and akin to the Greek verb ??????? (= paskhein, to suffer) and its cognate noun ????? (= pathos).

All Greek to me!!!

Needless to say I am presently dealing with some medical issues and have become frustrated with the process and AM NOT being a Patient Patient.

Les

Sorry to hear that Les. Hope it all works out in the end. I mean that in a positive way, not the inevitable way.

I've noticed doctor and dentist front office staffs generate the most complaints when I read on-line reviews. From personal experience I've found the same, but I rarely complain unless its really onerous and I am prepared to go elsewhere.

Doctor's offices and clinics are more of a production factory than a service business in the way they are managed. Due to a variety of factors including the massive regulation, the continuing assault by the legalized protection racket... er I mean insurance companies, and the fact that doctors are legally prohibited from ANY form of collective bargaining they have no choice but to operate like a production factory. The fact is there are fewer people going into medicine today per capita than ever.

My wife had surgery yesterday. Some things are better and one thing appears it might be worse. We shall see. If so it won't incapacitate her, but the net result might be a small net loss.

On the way home from the hospital I hit a canal bank for a few minutes of fishing. Just a few minutes in one spot, because the sun was already down. Never got a bite, but the spot was closer to town so I'm sure it sees lots of pressure. No excuses. I fished for 20 minutes and got skunked. LOL. Still fishing is better than not fishing.

uffer) and its cognate noun ????? (=

Hmmm Funny you should say that.(and keep in mind that my wife is a head nur se for a group of 5 surgeons)

Quite a number of years ago it finally dawned on me that the medical profes sion had really been taken over by the "legalized protection racket" (Good description Bob)(and thank you Hillary Clinton) and doctors were no longer in charge of their services. Up until then, doctors made a lot of money and could do just about anything they wanted to do as far as patient care. For the most part, patient care was from a compassionate source and although n ot perfect, it had worked through the ages successfully. Once the control h ad switched to the racketeers, it became a business.

I realized that pretty early on and began treating the medical profession a s a business. I call, make an appointment, I go to the office, and when I a rrive I tell them that I can wait no longer than one hours. I wait one hour and if not called. tell the receptionist I have to leave and please give m e another appointment. Their response is always, Oh the doctor will be righ t with you. And I say, I don't care, I'm leaving now, may I have another ap pointment? This usually creates a scurry of action behind the counter as it apparently never happens that a "customer" leaves because they are not get ting good service. I get the next appointment and if the same thing happens I have switched doctors twice in the last 15/20 years because I've had to consistently wait too long in waiting rooms. And, when I leave I make a big scene. A rant as you might describe it.

You have to make the change in the aspect that you look at this with.

Most people think of the doctor patient relationship as if the patient neee eds the doctor. But now that the insur --- umm racketeers have control. yo u can think of it as ----- the doctor neeeeds the patient. If you look at it that way, and that there is always another doctor you can go to, just li ke doing business, it changes how you can deal with them. For instance: Contest the price of services if inappropriate, I do not pay for services j ust added on that I haven't previously approved. During the filling out of forms where it says that I will be responsible for services not covered by my insurance, I don't sign it. I write in " I will not be responsible for u napproved services" They never check the forms for signature.

One outcome of that was ---- I had an opthamologist try to charge me $30.00 for some kind of extra test. I refused to pay it. They said I had signed a pproval. I said I didn't and they should check their records. They obviousl y never checked or if they did they continued to bill me for almost a year then sent it to collection. When I got the collection notice I wrote on the bill, " I did not approve payment for services not covered by my insuranc e." I never got another bill.

Another rant I went on was when I had a 3PM appointment with a doctor. When I arrived the waiting room was packed, standing room only. They asked me t o sign in. The sign-in sheet asked what time my appointment was so I wrote in 3PM. As I glanced at the list I saw that 5 other people had 3PM appointm ents with the same doctor. I asked the receptionist why there were so many for the same time and she said " Oh we regularly over book so the doctor is never without a patient." I just hit the ceiling! WHAT ???? So we're all s upposed to sit here for the next 2 or three hours because there are 5 other people with the same appointment time ? ? ? And what about the other docto rs here? Are they all over booked too? I loudly asked the other people in t he waiting room if they thought that was appropriate to do and did they pla n to spend the rest of their day waiting for a doctor who overbooked 5 peop le? AHHHHHGGGGGGG Two other people walked out with me after my rant. I'm sure they must have changed their sign-in sheet after that event.

Try it. Treat them like a business. It confuses the hell out of them.

And for me, it does my soul good 8-))

As I've said before. I used to wonder where cranky old men come from. Now I know.

Yup. We were born with an abundance of tolerance and a bunch of stupid people used it all up over the years.

Oh... I might make that a sig line somewhere.

YeAAH! I LIKE that ! ! !

Funny!! A number of years ago my wife was working for a Temp Agency. She was sent to a Dr. Office. She was told to double and triple every appointment. So your experience wins!!

Also about 20 years ago my family doctor retired and transferred all his patients to another doctor. I ended up making an appointment at the new office. I showed up as I always do about 5 minutes early. I checked in and took a seat in the waiting area. I sat there for 45 minutes before being called back to an exam room. Sat in the exam room for 15 minutes till the doctor came in. Bla Bla Bla He said, make an appointment for two weeks and I will give you small bottle to come back with a urine sample. So I went out to the counter and asked what was the very first appointment in the morning. The girl says that will be 8:30am. I said I will take the 8L30am appointment in two weeks. So, I returned again 5 minutes early for the 8:30am appointment. Checked in and went to the waiting area. There was another guy sitting there and he was doubled over in pain. In my humble opinion the guy was having a Kidney Stone attack. Having a large number myself I really do know.

Anyhow I sat there for 35 minutes. The other guy was still there as well and still in visible pain. At that point I got up and went to the counter and asked the girl "What is the value of having an appointment in this office." She giggled and said "What time was your appointment." To which I said, "It really doesn't matter because you can flush it!!" I slammed the pee bottle down and walked out.

Later when I got home I sat at my computer and drafted a letter to the doctor. Explaining and detailing my experiences in his office. At the end I stated the following. "You will find with this letter an invoice for my time. You may pay it or not. By your action I will understand."

Two weeks letter I received a check in the mail. I never went back and I found another doctor.

Les

Well, I've got two great takeaways from this thread.

1. Bob's "Proverb"

(I was) "We were born with an abundance of tolerance and a bunch of stupid people used it all up over the years."

I gotta try that next time.

Thanks

On 9/29/2020 8:29 PM, ABLE1 wrote: > On 9/29/2020 1:43 PM, Jim Davis wrote: >> >> Another rant I went on was when I had a 3PM appointment with a doctor. When I arrived the waiting room was packed, standing room only. They asked me to sign in. The sign-in sheet asked what time my appointment was so I wrote in 3PM. As I glanced at the list I saw that 5 other people had 3PM appointments with the same doctor. I asked the receptionist why there were so many for the same time and she said " Oh we regularly over book so the doctor is never without a patient." I just hit the ceiling! WHAT ???? So we're all supposed to sit here for the next 2 or three hours because there are 5 other people with the same appointment time ? ? ? And what about the other doctors here? Are they all over booked too? I loudly asked the other people in the waiting room if they thought that was appropriate to do and did they plan to spend the rest of their day waiting for a doctor who overbooked 5 people? >> AHHHHHGGGGGGG Two other people walked out with me after my rant. >> I'm sure they must have changed their sign-in sheet after that event. >> >> Try it. Treat them like a business. It confuses the hell out of them. >> >> And for me, it does my soul good 8-)) >> >> As I've said before. I used to wonder where cranky old men come from. >> Now I know. >> > > > Funny!! A number of years ago my wife was working for a Temp Agency. > She was sent to a Dr. Office. She was told to double and triple every > appointment. So your experience wins!! > > Also about 20 years ago my family doctor retired and transferred all his > patients to another doctor. I ended up making an appointment at the new > office. I showed up as I always do about 5 minutes early. I checked in > and took a seat in the waiting area. I sat there for 45 minutes before > being called back to an exam room. Sat in the exam room for 15 minutes > till the doctor came in. Bla Bla Bla He said, make an appointment for > two weeks and I will give you small bottle to come back with a urine > sample. So I went out to the counter and asked what was the very first > appointment in the morning. The girl says that will be 8:30am. I said > I will take the 8L30am appointment in two weeks. > So, I returned again 5 minutes early for the 8:30am appointment. > Checked in and went to the waiting area. There was another guy > sitting there and he was doubled over in pain. In my humble opinion > the guy was having a Kidney Stone attack. Having a large number myself > I really do know. > > Anyhow I sat there for 35 minutes. The other guy was still there > as well and still in visible pain. At that point I got up and went > to the counter and asked the girl "What is the value of having an > appointment in this office." She giggled and said "What time was > your appointment." To which I said, "It really doesn't matter > because you can flush it!!" I slammed the pee bottle down and > walked out. > > Later when I got home I sat at my computer and drafted a letter to > the doctor. Explaining and detailing my experiences in his office. > At the end I stated the following. > "You will find with this letter an invoice for my time. You may pay > it or not. By your action I will understand." > > Two weeks letter I received a check in the mail. I never went back > and I found another doctor.

Ever wonder if you made the wrong call? He did recognize your dilemma and pay for your time. All doctors except surgeons overbook. Most have posted policies that if you are no show there is a charge, and some will charge you for a walkout. Had that happen with a dentist once.

Their forms required you to waive all your HIPA rights, and had you agreeing to insanely onerous and maybe illegal collection practices. I black lined everything I didn't like. On my second visit they handed me the new patient form again to fill out and I black lined everything I didn't like again. This time instead of seeing me they told me I had to fill out the form again. I told them their form was illegal, and if they refused to remove the illegal parts or allow me to they were functionally refusing to see me. Of course they had a posted policy for no shows. They said I if did not complete the form "properly" they would not see me. I made a point of saying I was here on time for my appointment and you are refusing to see me. It would be in your best interest not to commit fraud by charging me as a no show, and I walked out. The dentist himself may not ave even been aware. He was nice, professional, and personable chair side.

They sent me a bill. I debated what to do for a couple days. Then I filed a complaint with the Arizona State Board Of Dental Examiners for HIPA violations and with the State Attorney General for institutional ongoing fraud and illegal collection practices.

I started shopping for a new dentist, and found one among my old clients who had all their forms publicly available on their website for patients to review at their leisure. There was nothing I objected to in any of their forms. I've been seeing them for years.

Many years ago I was in the Mesa/Tempe area watching a concert and firewoks show with a date. On the way back over the Salt River my car died on the bridge. I told my date to get behind the wheel and I would push. It was stop and go traffic. Mostly stop. As I got out of the car several guys boiled out of a pickup truck behind us and told me to get back in the car. They pushed us up the bridge, down the other side and a little way into an open parking lot. Probably a couple miles.

They asked if we needed a ride, but I called a cab and we spent the night on a the couch of a friend who lived nearby. The next morning I got a ride back over to my car to find one of the businesses in that little strip mall was an auto parts store.

I fixed it on the spot with tools I always kept in the car.

Hnnn Seems I don't remember the nice stories anymore ---only the ones that agitate me.

May be, that it's due to the diminished level of tolerance I have left :-)

Actually I did wonder if the doctor ever saw the letter or the invoice. My thinking is was handled by the office manager. I will never know.

Doubt it would make much difference as to how I sleep nights. :-)

Les

Oh and I only received a check for a 1 hour service call. Not an apology of any kind!!

You might say I'm suffering from a severe case of LTL

Awh. My comment about Low-T didn't go through earlier.

Ok, here is another one. Also involving a woman. (different one) She lived over in East Mesa and I was working in Dateland 150ish miles away. She called to see if I was coming up for the weekend. When I told her I didn't have enough gas money for my truck (11mpg), and my bike (45-55mpg) had a bad battery she said, "Come on up. If we have to we can push start your bike." She push started my motorcycle everywhere we went all weekend long and we ran all over Mesa and Tempe having fun and carrying on.

Outside one bar after she push started my bike, and before I could circle back to pick her up some guy decided to hit on her. She was enjoying her self way to much when I pulled up and she hopped on back. The guy looked totally dazed and confused when he saw me pull up.

When I got home I still had a couple dollars in my pocket. Not enough for a new battery for my bike, but enough to get me by until payday... which thankfully was Tuesday.

Hey... another bit of good news. I just saw the other day that diesel is less than gas again. Atleast around here. Since my gasser Jeep and my turbo diesel 4x4 truck both get about the same MPG I've been driving my truck more. I like driving my truck. I just might have to go out and get it stuck in the desert just for fun.

All right. Last woman story, but this one is a little different. Of course it starts with an appropriate amount of bragging and chest beating.

I had a buddy in college. We met in an archery class of all things. We were two of the best three shooters in the class. We were both also computer nerds. As a pair of self proclaimed brainiacs we had a similar interest in women, but every time I saw him talking with one she would greet me by name or worse he would mention one and I would pull out my little grey book and ask him if he wanted her phone number. Most of the time I did have her number, but once or twice I reached for my little grey book just get under his skin.

One day he asked me what my secret was. I told him it was simple. You need to show interest, but make sure you haven't invested to much of yourself into fear and fantasy before asking. If you are interested just ask. Ask them to go do something you would find fun to do with somebody else, and no I don't mean sex. Don't make up contrived romantic bullshit like a hot air balloon ride over Paris. If you like comic books invite her to a comic book convention. If a friend is playing guitar down at the coffee house then that. Demolition derby, fishing, whatever. Just make sure its something you would enjoy with them or anybody else. Not just something to impress.

My buddy wasn't convinced so I said, "I'll tell you what. Invite ten women out. Any ten women. You have to invite them to do something like I mentioned. They can be beautiful. They can be ugly. They can be smart. They can be a ditz. It can be the first time you met them. It doesn't matter. Just ask. There are only a few restrictions. They can't be anybody you ever asked out before. They can't be married. They can't have a boyfriend. If you do that I will bet you $100 that atleast five of them will go out with you, and atleast one them will try to sleep with you without you trying to sleep with them. You can't lose. Worse thing that happens you got a hundred bucks and you can go cruise Santa Monica Blvd next time you are in LA."

He took my challenge. The first five women he asked all went out with him, and three of them tried to sleep with him, so did number six. When he was taking my challenge every woman he asked went out with him. He never made it to ten. He married number seven.

my car

I would

got out of the

er side

les.

ning I

one) She

I told her

we

ere we

ough

esel

r Jeep and

o go out

Great story,

I was kind of laid back with (I'll have to say "girls" because I was only 1

I think the Blues were more impressive than the whites. But you put on thos e Blues with bell bottoms, 13 button flap, the neckerchief and cocked white hat, and it teaches you all that you said above about the male/female psyc he.

At least back then it did. I kind of have my doubts about how it would go o ver today. Now I think all it takes is a sock hat, a man bun or baseball ha t on backwards, a T-shirt with some trashy slogan, a pair of crew shorts ha nging down so your skivvies show and a pair of untied rip off Adidas.

Soooooo Jim,

When and where did you serve?

I served on board the USS Providence CLG-6 that was 1st Fleet Flag when I got on board in 1965 and then we deployed across the water to be the

Les

Another buddy of mine said it better. You just have to be perceived as a HAM and they will come to you. Healthy Adult Male. I found for me personally I just had to look like I was having more fun than the next guy. Sometimes that was enough to make the next guy who was just a HAM want to start a fight. LOL.