That could be it, then. I see there are motion sensors on the lights themselves that don't trigger, so I figured they're all hooked in together. I can get you pictures of anything tomorrow, but I'm not exactly sure what you're asking for. The AC to DC transformer is hidden behind insulation and I can't get at it, but I can have picture of the system box itself or the exterior lighting. The lights themselves are flush mounted and caulked, otherwise I probably would have pulled them out already to see what could be done with them.
This I might take you up > before you rip it apart figure out what the zones are and write it down. tag
I see where each zone connects on the board itself. I could tag the wires so they go to the same zones on the new board, but I still wouldn't know what each zone does. Is there a way to determine what zones monitor what sensors when the alarm is completely nonfunctional? I can bring up programming mode, but pretty much every setting I tried to access I was locked out of. I remember seeing a test mode, perhaps I'm not locked out of that.
I am familiar with 142's 162's and current panels but have never seen a
147 but the terminals should follow the same layout.
On the door to the panel there should be a print of the board and which terminals comprise each zone. Remove the wires from the zone terminals (wich are then tagged) then connect a mulitmeter to them. you should read about 2 K ohms on each zone for this board (If I'm wrong someone shout out) Then open doors and windows until you get an open (or a short if the device is normally open). Powered devices like motion detectors will have to be connected to 12 VDC. If the system was installed like ours then this should be the red and black wires on terminals 4 & 5 (again - if this is wrong someone correct me.)
If you can't tell then there is no harm in connecting everything from terminals 4 & 5 to the battery but I generally connect the pairs one at a time to see what they are powering.
may have a hard time downloading on a dsl line without a RJ31X DSL filter and access code if previously downloaded. better option would be to send the board to Rojas or Cambell to get unlocked. I think unlockiing will leave programming ??? intact.
Turn the Chime mode on (Code+Chime) then stand at the keypad with all doors/windows closed and have someone walk around and open doors/windows one at a time and make a list of what zone that opening shows on the keypad. On FA stuff Chime doesn't work for Interior devices (pirs) so you just have to watch which zone shows up when someone walks through each motion detector.
Then make up a list of zones.
(you can do it without the chime, but it helps the "walker" know when to move on to the next opening...saves yelling)
| > You need to provide the telco hookup so I can connect to it with my | > down loader. | | This I might take you up on. I'm considering going with a telco DSL | internet solution which provides an incoming phone line at no charge, | so you'd be able to dial in. The telco said they could have a line up | within a week. Give me a few days to get things in order and I'll get | back to you. I really appreciate the offer. | | On Apr 19, 11:59 pm, "Crash Gordon" | wrote: | > before you rip it apart figure out what the zones are and write it down. tag | > the wires so you know EXACTLY where they go...then maybe take Nelson's | > offer and you can get it back up and running with new board. | | I see where each zone connects on the board itself. I could tag the | wires so they go to the same zones on the new board, but I still | wouldn't know what each zone does. Is there a way to determine what | zones monitor what sensors when the alarm is completely | nonfunctional? I can bring up programming mode, but pretty much every | setting I tried to access I was locked out of. I remember seeing a | test mode, perhaps I'm not locked out of that. | |
Just a point of clarification....Jim Rojas does it for all of the USA and I (and one other person on the west coast), do if for Canada (saves border hassles). And yes, the board can usually be unlocked without messing up the existing programming. There is someone in the USA on the Califormia coast who offers a gimmicky but slightly risky way of doing it with a widget they have invented...www.unlocker.com. Dunno if it works on this make of board though...
It's far less hassle just to buy another board and start fresh. Most of the low end alarm equipment today is in the same league as computer equipment...any problems, just throw it away. Besides, learning to program it from the getgo will allow you the freedom to make changes later on (assuming you don't hook up with another company for monitoring)
Has anyone made our intrepid advendurer aware that he needs to identify the resistance of the EOLR's (assuming they are not in the panel) and ensure that he replaces this board (if that is the route he chooses) with one that uses the same values?
That will save him from having to find them, dig them out and change them.
If they are in the panel (which I would almost bet on) then he is home free...
Care to clarify what this means for something who knows nothing about alarms? End of line resistance, perhaps? There are a collection of resistors sitting unused in the panel, and I have the capability to measure the resistances of various paths as I know my way around a multimeter.
End Of Line Resistor. Which theoretically should be...well...at the END of the line.
Different alarm panels use different value resistors, so if they were installed where they theoretically belong (at the end of the line) then you'd maybe hafta dig them out of the wall(s) to change them...theoretically speaking of course.
Some panels use different values on the same board...like one for burg zone, an different one for fire zone...and sheesshhhhh another for zone-doubling (yikes on that one)
| > That will save him from having to find them, dig them out and change them. | >
| > If they are in the panel (which I would almost bet on) then he is home | > free... | | Care to clarify what this means for something who knows nothing about | alarms? End of line resistance, perhaps? There are a collection of | resistors sitting unused in the panel, and I have the capability to | measure the resistances of various paths as I know my way around a | multimeter. | |
End of Line resitors are used to supervise alram circuits and inform the panel that someon has either opened a circuit (cut the wire) or has shorted a circuit (trying to bypass the protected opening.
If you don't see resistors connected to the zone terminals then either the resistors are out in the field or they weren't used at all (can a
147 do this?).
If its an ademco built panel then I would guess that each zone uses the same value.(will a 147 zone double?)
Using the diagram on the inside of the cover (at least one should be there) remove the wires from the two terminals that make up one zone and check the resitance. I would guess that you are looking for either one or two K Ohms. of course you have to veryfy that the circuit you are checking is in working order so you will have to identify which opening the zone covers and then check it with the door open and then closed. If it is a motion detector then you have to apply power to the device in order to get proper readings.
If Zone doubling was done (two independent zones operating from a single set of zone terminals by employing two different valued resitors in paralell that in the normal state equate to the typical resistance the panel looks for. When the resistance changes the panel knows which zone has been faulted by the remaining resistance) you will then have to identify which two openings (or groups of openings) are covered and by the resitance values which zone they are.
If you want replace the panel and the reistors are in the field then you have to find a panel that matches those values.
Let's just hope that isn't the case since this would take an experienced tech (or two) quite a while to map out. It's doubtful.
Anyway, if you want replace the panel and the reistors are in the field then you have to find a panel that matches those values. You are in luck there since Ademco (now Honeywell) made the First Alert line of products and hasn't played around too much with resistor values so any First Alert o Vista panel from that era will likely work.
I say all this with the caveat that I have never worked on an FA147 so my musings could be way off.
Perhaps the original owner no longer wanted to use the alarm and asked for it to be disabled so it can never cause any headaches. Your assumption is a) the panel is locked and b) the servicing/installation co. disabled the alarm wrongly and should then enable it for free.
Where's the proof it's locked out? The original poster doesn't have enough knowledge to say it's locked out with certainty.
And if it was disabled per the request of the original homeowner, then the installing co. SHOULD charge for the service call to enable it.
I've had calls from people who've purchased a home with an alarm in it and they don't want it. They want it removed, but instead will power the system down so it can't make any noise and I unplug the phone jack so it can't tie up the phone line. If the house sells and the next owner wants the alarm up and running, damned right there's a charge. And it's a valid charge. If you purchase a house and the oven doesn't work, should the original seller (eg. Sears) return to fix it for free? Good luck with that! Even if the previous homeowner requested the oven be disabled the new owner has to deal with it and pay for repairs if necessay.
Doing the right thing..... BS. My time and material is valuable. If I'm out doing free work all day, how do the bills get paid? You may choose to live in voluntary poverty, but you're one of only a very few.
In over 30 years in the business I have yet ti see a case where that has happened. I have seen numerous alarms that had been disabled by the installing company when the alarm owner canceled the monitoring contract after completing the original term.
BTW, on one occasion I replaced an alarm system which had been disabled by the alarm company in a restaurant which had been sold. The original owners canceled prior to selling the building. When we installed the system we removed and boxed up the old hardware (Radionics stuff) and called the original dealer to inform them where to pick up the panel if they wanted it since the box said "Propert of ###" on the cover.
The original alarm company never came to pick up the panel during the several months the building was being modified. A month after the new place opened I was invited for dinner by the new owners. I went in the office and they still had the old hardware in the box where I'd put it. I called the company again and reminded them to get their hardware. When they didn't respond for another two weeks the customer throough it out.
A month or so later the company contacted the customer and demanded he return their system, pay them $2,000 for the "software" in the dialer (the "software" was actually just their phone number and the account number) or sign with them for a new system which they would monitor. The customer told them where to go. They threatened suit against him for theft and me for tortious interference. Idiots!
A very common occurence.
It doesn't belong to them. They had no right to disable it. How would you feel if Huyndai disabled your new car because you didn't pay them to service it after the warranty expired?
Where's the proof that it's not?
That is an assumption you are making based on wishful thinking. Making your argument based on an unlikely assumption is practically... well, Bush-like.
Sears doesn't disable ovens after the homeowner pays for them.
I haven't run across any disabled or locked out ovens lately. Have you?
Well there's only two bypass strategies on this board. Neither one of them work. Viewing the installer code is locked out, and attempting to change any values produces an error. Beyond that, it's certainly locked out as Guardian themselves have told me that they locked me out.
It wasn't. I've talked to the previous homeowner about it and they disabled the alarm the day they canceled their monitoring service.
Are you kidding me? If it was unplugged from the power and phone line, any idiot could fix it without your help. No need to have the original servicer return at all! Obviously they should pay you for your time should you have to come out, but there would be no reason for you to. Besides that, they could press a few buttons on their downloader and be done with it. I've now tested all the zones and the system is completely functional, they just shut it down. They could re-enable it remotely if they weren't being such jerks about it.
You sound pretty defensive about the whole thing. In any case, you've completely skirted the issue. I've asked Guardian to come out and fix the board and pay for the service call, and they flat out refuse. They now claim that even though I'm the owner of the system, the only way they're required by law to let me pay them to come out and fix it is if the smoke alarms are function only with the system enabled. Mine function without the alarm, so they told me to get lost. The issue is not that I wouldn't pay them to fix it, it's that they won't do it at all.
He should not have to pay them for monitoring in order to get them to undo the wrong which they did. The alarm company is a bunch of thieves. Why defend them?
I want it working only locally for now, which they won't do. They will re-enable it if I sign a monitoring contract with them. I'd considered telling them "Sure, set it up", keeping it for a month, disconnecting the phone line, and then canceling. Not with a contract, though. And with my luck they'd send someone out insisting to be let in to shut it down. Then they started acting like jerks and I wouldn't give them a dime. That's too bad for them. If they had cooperated now, we may have considered using them for monitoring down the road at some point. I have now received no less than 3 mailers from them telling me to I should sign a monitoring contract with them. I've only had the house for a week.
The phone company was out today, so I now have an incoming line. I'm on my way to swapping out the board.
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