LOL A Real On Topic Question!! Imagine that!!

Hey guys!!

I have serious question. I have a customer that has a door access keypad mounted on a single gang plastic box that it mounted on the side of a steel building next to the door. The keypad is a IEI 212W which is weather rated.

The original keypad was installed 5+ years ago. Last week the customer reported that the code was not always working. It took a couple of tries on the keypad to get the code to energize the electric strike.

When I got on site all looked good but I noticed that that not all keys were reliable. The decision was made to just replace the keypad. I ordered a new unit, same model, and installed two days later. Programmed and all was good.

When removing the old keypad I noticed some rust on a few terminals. Upon further inspection back at my office I noticed some other areas on the circuit board that had some spots that may have been moisture related.

First off this keypad was mounted with the supplied foam gasket and tight. The inside of the box was dry.

The only opening to the box is where the wire penetrates the back from the inside wall cavity.

The question is how did water get inside the box and on the keypad terminals and circuit board??

I am thinking condensation. If I am right then how to fix the problem??

This is where I stop typing and look to read possible solutions from the crowd.

Oh and local temperatures range from 20F to 100F +/-

Thanks for any thoughts!!

Les

Reply to
ABLE1
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think your right about the condensation, have had that problem many times around here.. seal the wire hole as best you can to avoid the inside/outside air mixing.. Then my favorite trick is place a few of those desiccant packages in the cavity.. In really damp places I've done the ole Blue Grass Electronic trick and cover the electronic board with candle wax..

Reply to
RTS

Thanks Rocky, I like the candle wax thought. Although I have read somewhere that certain waxes have bad effects on circuit boards.

The desiccant packs would be a help as well. But, they can only catch so much moisture. Although you never see it unless you you the ones that turn blue.

What are your thoughts on a small resistive type heater in the box to keep it warm so that the humidity will not condense.

Thanks,

Les

Reply to
ABLE1

Heard of that being tried. It seems "lady bugs" like those warm spaces, Don't ask me how, but those little things can get into some really tight spots..

I opened a satellite control box (hanging under the dish) one time and it was packed full solid with them.. (and it was a nema box)

also don't want it too warm, those Capacitors don't like heat..

Reply to
RTS

Agreed!! Will a thermostat to turn on heater at a specific temp of maybe 34F to 38F. This is getting more challenging to say the least.

As for the Lady Bugs it only takes one female to lay 1000 eggs and then when they grow up they fill the box. :-)

Reply to
ABLE1

Dielectric silicone grease. ADI used to have it in toothpaste tubes cheaper than anybody. Alternatively go down to Blows or Home Despot and buy some silicone faucet grease (expensive for a small amount). I also used to drill weep holes in all my outdoor mounted boxes. Positioned so they were well below any hole through the wall. Also... this is an indoor product, but DAP tub and tile caulk (maybe it says seal) (clear) that comes in the squeeze tube forms an amazing seal between a box and a building. It comes out white, but dries clear and is very low visibility to only minimally offend the customer.

One of the spray on LPS silicons also does an amazing job of waterproofing, but a) I don't know how long it lasts, and b) don't recall which one. I remember seeing a guy operating a corded brush motor drill in a fish tank at a trade show when I was a kid. He would shake the water out, spray the heck out it through the vents, and then stick it his hand back in the fish tank to run the drill again.

I used to have the bubble switches wear out in those 212W keypads. Replaced two on the back door of my old office for that reason. I switched to the ruggedized 212 with the buttons and its own box and they seem to last. I have one that I used in several locations for temporary access control when waiting on parts for repairs that is now at the back door of my shop. I sealed the face plate and the back surface to the wall with DAP. Its been in full time service since 2014 and was used when I installed it. Any significant moisture gets in them and they stop working, but they usually start again when you dry them out. I have a couple new ones still on the shelf.

__ Bob Not an alarm guy... any more.

Reply to
Bob La Londe

Thanks Bob, At this point the Maintenance Guy on staff at the site is going to perform his own magic on the keypad. Some with my hints.

I thought of putting a weep hole in as well. But then you get the other downsides of: a) Bugs making nest (Hole to big) b) Icicles blocking hole (Hole to small) c) Don't know but there always has to be a "C"

Have a good holiday!!

Les

Reply to
ABLE1

As long as the hole is small enough to keep the lizards out I am good.

Aside: Back when I worked for Arizona Telephone (bought out later by TDS Telecom I think) we lost a T carrier system. It was full, so 24 customers were out of service. When we got out to the remote communications hut and started looking we found a lizard fried across the encoder card.

P.S. Even if you drill a weep hole you still need to coat the electronic connections with dieletric grease in a humid environment.

Bob

Reply to
Bob La Londe

Hi Les,

I've used this in the past

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Granted it was a long time ago, but I never had to go back and change the k eypad so it worked Ok. Viking Telecom Solutions has an option on their outdoor products to weather proof them but I don't know if they have a keypad or not. Besides I think they all they do is just dip their PCB's in some kind of gook and charge yo u another $100.00

I'm thinking that just dipping (or painting) the PCB in some polyurethane w ould do the same thing and last at least 5 or ten years.

Reply to
alarminex

Hey Jim,

Now that is some serious STUFF!! Never heard of that before.

I will have to source that at my local distributor. Grainger closed their local store a few years ago. I liked going there to pickup a specific thing or two. Always good to walk the isles to get ideas.

Thanks for the tip. Much appreciated.

Les

Reply to
ABLE1

he keypad so it worked Ok.

ther proof them but I don't know if they have a keypad or not. Besides I th ink they all they do is just dip their PCB's in some kind of gook and charg e you another $100.00

ne would do the same thing and last at least 5 or ten years.

Just Google CRC Urethane Seal Coat and I'm sure you can find it and other b rands of PCB seal coatings on line.

Reply to
alarminex

We used to use Scotch Coat on skinned underground cable. Pretty good stuff. If the damage was no more than than into the armor sheath it never failed. Coat, tape, coat again. For actual conductor damage we would use real splice kits filled with resin. Anyway Scotch Coat is good stuff, but brush on.

Reply to
Bob La Londe

My local distributor carries CRC products. I just need to call and find if in stock or needs to order. Easy to do either way.

Reply to
ABLE1

Bob,

Maybe is should be spelled 3M ScotchKote. Seems to look up better. :-)

Have a good weekend.

Les

Reply to
ABLE1

Meh! You found it.

Merry Christmas

Reply to
Bob La Londe

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