Need advice on Motel Wireless Setup

Have you considered an alternative? We used powerline networking at a school (much faster that the internet pipe, fast enuf for student email or surfing, only slow for node to node file transfers), and had a bunch of AP/powerline network connectors that could be plugged in as needed (Handy for temp classrooms, or new classrooms that were out of the other wireless areas, had to plug the AP in for power, why not use it for network connection too).. Seems like it would sure be fast enuf for motel clients...pretty cheap too, about $200 for AP an powerline network connection.

"Peter Pan" hath wroth:

While we're talking about alternatives, it seems that most hotels have existing CATV coax runs to each room. There are systems that piggyback ethernet on CATV coax cables.

Just an add on to above, My sister bought, and is moving into a new house, but the metal firewalls, sauna, and whirlpool mess with wireless (tuff place to have to stay for a few weeks and get this stuff installed :).. Netgear has a new powerline network that does 85Mb (rather than 14Mb on the other systems).. Heck that's faster than G... The plug in part is $199 (instead of $149) so it would be up to about $250 a node with an AP (The 85 was announced in Nov of 2005 see http://206.82.202.35/About/PressReleases/en-US/2005/20051115.aspx and is currently shipping, they announced a 200Mb system last week http://206.82.202.35/About/PressReleases/en-US/2006/20060626.aspx but haven't seen it on the shelfs, so it may be vaporware), but heck, 85Mb is way faster than I ever expected to see, and now I'm rethinking metal hulled ships and how to get wired/wireless network in a metal box...

Hi, Me,

There are lots of more knowledgeable folks here, most of whom will assert that these will work just fine. The ethernet port is for configuration; the factory default is either .1 or .2 in the 198.168.1 range. The antenna sounds just like my omni stick.

On the bottom left of the board next to the antenna end of the card you would see NL-2611 along with other numbers. Documentation, firmware updates, and drivers are available, and once you've confirmed that's what you have, if you make these work but just needed more of them, to help out with the range issues, I've a couple which I'd let go reasonably :{))

HTH...

L8R

Skip

not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) hath wroth:

I guess this is an omnidirectional antenna.

Yep. That's a repeater. Bad idea. Repeaters are badly specified in IEEE 802.11-1999 and implimentation is spotty. The Wi-Fi Alliance doesn't even certify repeaters to be Wi-Fi compliant:

My guess(tm) is that these boxes can be reconfigured as access points. That will work, but you need to run CAT5 from the main router to these access points. Since there are only two, that's not a major project. You can use phone line, power line, or CATV coax as a backhaul if desperate.

Is there an FCC ID number on the serial number tag? If so, it can be identified. A photo (don't post to the newsgroup) can also help identify the box.

There's not you can do with the insides. All the important stuff is in the web based configuration.

Let's play dollars and cents. If you throw away the two repeaters, run CAT5 to the router, and replace them with something that works, my guess is about $250 to $500. What's your time worth working with an unknown and apparently non-functional box? I suggest you start over. However, find someone local that has a clue about 2.4GHz systems. You might have problems with RF going through walls, security issues, authentication, authorization, neighbors, hackers, etc.

Jeff, Skip and all. Thanks, this is a start. Enuff so I can tell I'm out of my league.

I think I can at least describe the problem and suggest a workable solution. That is, junk what's there and find someone who knows enough to set one up right. One would think that, since "free wireless in every room" is one of the motel chain's big selling points, they would have suggestions of folks who can do it right.

My guess is that the motel owner (an absentee) is simply too cheap to hire somebody competent. Left to her own devices, the manager called me because I clean up her home machine when her kids get it full of spies.

I've made my first visit to wireless.wikia.com, and there is lots there I need to read before proceeding. It is possible I could figure it out, but it's gonna be one of those "learning experiences" we blunder into from time to time. I don't mind learning, but I hate to do it in a business environment, especially someone else's business.

Thanks for your help. Anybody who has other thoughts, please chime in. I'll check back, and bug you some more after I read through the website.

Thanx, CJon

Update - Following the advice I received, I collected all the info on a Senao CB3+ (NL-2611) I could find and went back. The PCB was not exactly as described by Skip, but close. When I plugged into the LAN port, I got nothing (a network cable is unplugged) regardless of how I set the lappy up. I was able to reset it, based on the directions for the CB3+, but I still couldn't get into the setup page. I can connect to it, but I can't communicate with it. I can't ping it and a tracert simply fails.

If I understand what I have read, I would imagine it is configured as an access point, but I thought after I reset it back to the defaults, I should be able to get into the web-based utility and set it up. Not the case.

At this point, the folks at the motel are looking for someone who knows WiFi and can fix it. I have to agree with them. It is one of those things that they need done NOW, and while a learning experience is always good, it is nearly always slow.

Anybody know a good wifi consultant in the Kansas City to Des Moines corridor?

Thanks for the advice - CJon

Are you sure of the:

(1) IP address of the Senao?

(2) PC port being correctly configured for the same netblock?

On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 00:07:25 GMT, not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) wrote in :

John, Good to see you. Haven't talked to you since dcom.modems years ago.

To answer you, No, and No. I'm not even positive it is a Senao. It is a PCB in a metal wall box, similar, but not identical to what Skip described on 7/31. I think I'll take a photo and post a link to it. Maybe you or someone else will recognize it.

I did a hardware reset as described in the manual for the NL-2611 I downloaded, and it did clear the name of "Bravo" to now be "Wireless", but my attempts to access it at it's default of 192.168.1.1 failed completely. I show a strong (100%) signal, but no communication.

Two questions:

1. Would the setting from bridge to access point survive the hardware reset?
2. Would an assigned IP also survive the hardware reset?

My thought was "No" to both, but if that were the case, shouldn't I be able to connect to the (now bridge) at its default after the reset?

Thanks, CJ>Are you sure of the:

On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 13:05:54 GMT, not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) wrote in :

:)

Is there an FCC ID on it? If so, that can be used to identify it.

Configure your PC to talk to the device over Ethernet, and run %COMSPEC%" /K IPCONFIG /ALL Post the results here so we can see what's going on. The port may not be configured properly.

What do you mean by "bridge to access point?"

Probably not.

You mean to the web interface? A bridge is transparent.

I didn't see one. Possibly it is on the back of the board, which I haven't yet removed from the wall box.

A project for this evening, when I get the photos. When I tried to talk to it via ethernet before, all I got was "a network cable is unplugged" or whatever the XP equivalent is.

The online manual describes configuring the NL-2611 as either a bridge or an access point. There is a setting in the web configuation screens to change this back and forth. I assume it was originally set as an AP when the other guys set it up. Bridge is the default setting, and it was my thought that when I did the hardware reset, it would go back to that.

Yes, the web interface, which I cannot access thus far.

On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 19:54:53 GMT, not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) wrote in :

That means no Ethernet connection, making it pointless to try anything else. Possibilities:

1. wrong type of cable (crossover versus standard).
2. Defective cable.
3. Port is dead.

Hi, Me,

As seen elsewhere in this forum, I have an unfortunately large body of experience with these units.

The factory default reset is done with the button between the power supply and the ethernet connection. However, if you want to switch between AP and Bridge, you have to do it via web interface. The factory reset will put it in the same function as it was (bridge or AP) but will reset the IP and call the SSID it's looking for "wireless", etc., if it were a bridge. If AP, it will call itself "wireless" - but you can label it whatever you want in the configuration screens. It won't have encryption or MAC filtering enabled in factory default, either...

Yes, you need a crossover cable to talk to it. You could start with the factory default of 192.168.1.1 to see if you can address it to examine the current settings - but your NIC would have to be configured to be in the same net block, not DHCP

As described earlier, if you look at the bottom of the board next to the card you'll see the info on what you have. Look at the board with the electrical connections to the card on the right and the black part with the antenna end inputs on the left; the info will be in the lower left corner.

The better connection for the antenna is the one away from the power supply. In the orientation I've just described, the power supply is on the top.

antenna power, or enough of them, to reach all the rooms. I know John will have more accurate terminology than I to resolve the issue, but if you have 2611s, the above's the way to confirm that, and to interrogate them, and, as well, to start over (by giving each one of them new addresses).

As before, I'm willing to sell mine. I've confirmed that they work to my purpose, but I'd like to get 'g' enabled units, so if you merely need more of them to accomplish your ends, I'm your man. Mine have never been beyond a breadboard testing stage, and while I get a lot of grief for my inability to talk geek, and have stumbled (or whatever you call having a network engineer look at the traffic and analyze what's going on, and resolving a year's worth of beating my head against the wall) into a workable solution to my prior challenges, at least I have mine functioning, proving that what I want to do *can* be done (never successfully demonstrated before).

Drop me a line if you find you'd like them. skipgundlach at gmail dot com...

Meanwhile, good luck in your solutions. From what little I see it's pretty straightforward to solve, and not very expensive, either. I apologize for the lack of geek speak; I'm not fluent, but I trust the above communicates...

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at

"Believe me, my young friend, there is *noth> > >

OK, With the crossover cable, I can connect to "Bravo". I ran the comspec /k ipconfig /all and got the following: Note the Wired connection is "Bravo" and the wireless is the router that is connected to the motel's DLS modem.

Windows IP Configuration

Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : sager Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . : Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Unknown IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Ralink RT2500 Wireless LAN Card Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-0E-2E-50-7B-60 Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.190.16 Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0 Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.190.1 DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.190.1 DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 216.139.111.54 216.139.111.54 Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Sunday, August 13, 2006

Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Realtek RTL8139 Family PCI Fast Ethe rnet NIC Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-90-F5-0E-C6-FC Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.100 Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0 Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

I set the IP and Subnet mask for the ethernet adapter manually, per the instructions in the manual I downloaded for the 2611. The manual didn't show a gateway entered, so I didn't enter one. In looking at the info for the router, I'm wondering if I shouldn't have used

Skip seemed to indicate that when I reset it (as I did), it would label itself "wireless", which it did, and go back to the factory IP (192.168.1.1). I tried the above setup using that as the default gateway, to no avail.

I have posted a couple of photos here:

Thanks for your c>On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 19:54:53 GMT, not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) wrote

not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) hath wroth:

Does the serial number label have the FCC ID number? That will be a big help. If there's no FCCID, then it was either a home made repackage job, or an illegal import.

The MAC address of the wireless card shows that it is made by:

The MAC address on the main board is different:

On Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:23:41 GMT, not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) wrote in :

Good.

Bad: Not on the same subnet as the interface.

Bingo! :)

Note the DHCP server address above: 192.168.190.1 That's almost certainly the web interface address as well.

Hi, Me,

Unfortunately, the boards you have are defiintely not the Senao 2611. I can't help you with what you have.

If you need a couple more APs to expand your range, holler. I'm about to start some pull-up-the-mast-in-a-bucket tests, still never installed...

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at

"Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing, messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats. In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter, that's the charm of it. Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."

Turns out the AP's were Sputnik AP-200's, not NL-2611's as was suspected (and confirmed after I posted the photos).

With the time crunch the motel was facing, I turned it over to a networking guy I know and he simply reset them, hard wired them to the router, and sent a bill.

They work, the motel is happy, and my friend is money ahead. Maybe he'll buy me a beer.

Thanks for all your help. For me, it was a learning experience.

CJ>I have a problem. Friend of mine manages a motel with "wireless access

On Sun, 20 Aug 2006 16:08:15 GMT, not snipped-for-privacy@nor.tomorrow.not (Me) wrote in :

Good for him -- that's the best way to go.