Most people can't talk on a cellphone and drive safely, study finds [Telecom]

Most people can't talk on a cellphone and drive safely, study finds March 30, 2010 | 10:00 am

Shari Roan Los Angeles Times

Only a talented few can simultaneously talk on a cellphone and drive safely, according to a study from researchers at the University of Utah. The danger of a study like this is, of course, that everyone will think they are in the 2.5% of all people whom the study found to be "supertaskers." The pertinent fact is that 97.5% of us can't drive safely while talking on the phone -- even a hands-free phone.

The researchers assessed the performance of 200 people using simulated freeway driving while conducting a conversation on a hands-free phone that involved memorizing words and solving some math problems. Performance was measured in braking, reaction time, following distance, memory and math execution.

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Reply to
Steven
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Which is exactly why people should have to *prove* that they have the ability to do anything like this - as well as all the other things most people believe they either have the skills to do or are "entitled" to do because others do it.

Put together a difficult, realistic test (you know, like the ones that pilots have to do before being accredited to fly) that requires many dollars and lots of time to pass, and then the "talented few" may well qualify to use a phone while driving.

Such tests will need to be repeated every few years to ensure that the skills are still there - no "licence for life" rubbish - which also won't be cheap.

Let's see how many really do have these skills, because I won't mind them doing such things if they can keep proving that that they are capable - even give them a little badge to wear in public so we can all identify these people who will be in that tiny percentage of the driving population!

-- Regards, David.

David Clayton Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Knowledge is a measure of how many answers you have, intelligence is a measure of how many questions you have.

Reply to
David Clayton

That will not help, pilots use cell phone and laptops and both are violations of airline policy and Federal law.

Reply to
Steven

Since almost everyone would fail, is there really any reason to have the test? Do those 2.5% who can do it really need to, so that we should have a special license that allows them? They can almost certainly live within the contraints of the rest of the population.

It seems like the only point of the test would be so that people would learn objectively that they can't do it. But do you really think that would change their behavior? I've seen my cholesterol numbers, it hasn't gotten me to change my eating habits.

Reply to
Barry Margolin

.......

Failing a skills test should be an obvious message to people that they actually do not have the ability to do what they believe they can.

I have done advanced car control courses which clearly showed everyone on the courses what their limitations were, and a lot of us now try and stay within them.

Maybe it won't change the behaviour of a lot of people, but it's better than the situation that now exists where fools believe that they are capable of doing things that they obviously shouldn't - despite the law.

-- Regards, David.

David Clayton Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Knowledge is a measure of how many answers you have, intelligence is a measure of how many questions you have.

Reply to
David Clayton

Tell that to AT&T, I'm getting tired of having to take the test to keep my Red Card with them and be allowed to work. Same test same answers and I pass it each time, in the years I have done contract work for them and others I have never had a problem or caused any major outages.

Reply to
Steven

Depends on the pilot. Private pilots are subject to minimal testing and some never seek further training after a fairly easy training course. Professsion pilots are a different matter (for good operators at least)

How about every six months like the professional pilots do?

Reply to
Sam Spade

How do you know airline pilots use cell phones in flight?

As to laptops, some airlines require their use during certain phases of flight to make complex airport performance calculations. The abuse indicdent at NWA got blown way out of contect, because the laptops were being used for personal purposes plus NWA did not have a certified laptown performance program, unlike some airlines.

Reply to
Sam Spade

Whatever is reasonable, the whole concept that someone who passes a test that is directly reliant on a set level of physical and mental skills at one point in time and is then assumed to retain those skills forever is absurd.

-- Regards, David.

David Clayton Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Knowledge is a measure of how many answers you have, intelligence is a measure of how many questions you have.

Reply to
David Clayton

On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:04:42 -0700, Steven wrote: .........

But do you know of those that don't pass the test?

Having regular tests like these is just about necessary now in any specialised area because of the significant minority that don't do the right thing.

As an example, we have recently had a major political uproar here over a government insulation scheme where dodgy contractors ended up causing fires and electrocutions by not following the law. The trouble is that there are still a lot of similar problem caused by allegedly qualified electricians and insulation installers as well, and I'm not sure if these people ever have to re-qualify after receiving their initial accreditation.

Unfortunately it's human nature for a significant number of people to let standards slip in any industry, and the only solution at the moment is the "lowest common denominator" fix where everyone is required to do things that may not be necessary for a lot of them - like regular re-qualification.

If there's a better solution to maintaining standards in all sorts of areas, I'd like to hear about it.

-- Regards, David.

David Clayton Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Knowledge is a measure of how many answers you have, intelligence is a measure of how many questions you have.

Reply to
David Clayton

I have a friend who was a pilot for a very large airline and she said they do it all the time, it may not be dangerous since once the plane is up and out of local control it is pretty much automatic. The calls are for the most part business, but some are personal. I got an e-mail while she was flying over the North Atlantic last year, she was not flying the plane at the time, her first officer was, but she was in the cabin.

Reply to
Steven
+--------------- | Sam Spade wrote: | > David Clayton wrote: | >> Put together a difficult, realistic test (you know, like the ones that | >> pilots have to do before being accredited to fly) ... .... | > Depends on the pilot. Private pilots are subject to minimal testing and | > some never seek further training after a fairly easy training course. | > Professsion pilots are a different matter (for good operators at least) | >>

| >> Such tests will need to be repeated every few years to ensure that the | >> skills are still there - no "licence for life" rubbish - which also | >> won't be cheap. | >

| > How about every six months like the professional pilots do? | | Whatever is reasonable, the whole concept that someone who passes a test | that is directly reliant on a set level of physical and mental skills at | one point in time and is then assumed to retain those skills forever is | absurd.

+---------------

In fact, even private pilots must pass a flight review[1] every two years in order to keep flying, per FAR 61.56 (quoted in [1]) which requires:

...a minimum of 1 hour of flight training and 1 hour of ground training. The review must include: (1) A review of the current general operating and flight rules of Part 91 of this chapter; and (2) A review of those maneuvers and procedures that, at the discretion of the person giving the review, are necessary for the pilot to demonstrate the safe exercise of the privileges of the pilot certificate.

[Note: Part 91 contains the bulk of the regulations applying generally to all pilots. Commercial pilots have to follow Part 135 (commercial) and/or Part 121 (air transport) regs as well.]

Plus, there are other rules regarding "currency of experience" in order to be legal for various types of flight operations. E.g., in order to carry *any* passengers a private pilot must have done at least three takeoffs & landings within the last three months [and if carrying passengers at night, the required TOs/landings must have been performed at night and to a "full stop" rather than "touch-and-go"s.] For instrument rated (IFR) pilots, there's a whole other set of currency requirements, etc.

Would that we had something a *tenth* as rigorous for automobile drivers!!

-Rob

[1] Used to be called the "Biennial Flight Review" (BFR) a.k.a. "beef-er", but was renamed a few years ago to simply "flight review", since different types of flight reviews are required for the different categories of licenses and flight conditions. For a *very* good summary of the requirements, see:

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Pilot's Guide to the Flight Review [8 pages]

----- Rob Warnock

627 26th Avenue San Mateo, CA 94403 (650)572-2607
Reply to
Rob Warnock

The test is open book and most of the time you take it online. It is a standard TEIG manual that all the Bells use and have used, plus many other telecom companies also use it.

The information is Telecom 101 and you would learn it your first week in training. I have been doing the job for 43 years and it has changed but is still the same.

I have seen some bad work, but the people that do it don't last more then a day or so, no one on my crew gets anywhere near live equipment until I see how they work. I will not even put up with cross stitching and I do not allow cable ties unless it is a temp until it is stitched in place. 43 years ago when when I was learning my supervisor put me with a 68 year old Western Electric CO installer and said to watch and do what he tells you to do and you will learn the right way; for 2 years I did until he told me I can now do it on my own and I still teach that way.

Reply to
Steven

How did she use her cell phone over the North Atlantic?

BTW, I was a pilot for TWA for 27 years. Just like every other line of work some people do it right; some don't.

So far as using a cell phone once at cruise altitude, it is harmless enough provided they are also minding the store. As we saw from the recent NWA fiasco they don't always mind the store.

As a group, most of them are less competent today than before all the automatics came into existence. I know, I flew both types. But, we always had autopilots for en route flight.

***** Moderator's Note *****

You're the best choice to answer the question everybody asks about cellphones on airplanes: "Why are they banned"?

Bill Horne Moderator

Reply to
Sam Spade

She was using her laptop, it was an e-mail, the plane had WiFI. As far as using a cell phone, I have used mine on planns with no problems, not over the North Atlantic, We were told we could use cell phone after reaching flying altitude. I have only been asked not to connect once on a flight with my laptop. As to using my cell, I have found that it works most of the time, but as in dead zones on the ground you get them on plans. I was on a flight to Japan that had WIFI for free in Business and First Class and $25.00 for anyone else, I tend to use my miles for upgrade, as it is to hard to use them for getting a ticket

Reply to
Steven

They are approved by some, perhaps many, foreign carriers.

It almost came into being here a year, or so, ago but the consensus was that our population is generally so rude that it would make already almost unbearable flights truly unbearable.

And, before analog went away, the FCC had a legitimate gripe about hitting multiple cell sites and creating problems.

Plus, the GTE Skyfone was still alive then (remember in the seat backs for really high rates?)

***** Moderator's Note *****

I'm feeling foolish: I always believed what the airlines said about how cellphones might interfere with the navigational equipment. Was that a lie?

Bill Horne Moderator

Reply to
Sam Spade

Yes. But, trust me Bill, they have never lied to you before and probably won't again.

Reply to
Sam Spade

Heh ... that's the hall mark of a *good* teacher, no matter what the subject matter: you not only learn that subject matter, you learn how to pass it on to the next generation too.

Cheers, -- tlvp

-- Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP

Reply to
tlvp

NASA has a system where they collect reports from pilots about various unsafe conditions. The did a report on computer and cell phone interference. You can find it at

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What they say about this kind of interference includes:

The data clearly indicates that not only were some events judged as having had a critical effect on a system, but they also happened during critical stages of flight specifically landings and takeoffs.

Reply to
Ron

That is or was the way it was done. When I started college I planned on being a teacher, during the summer break I went to work for General Telephone, when I went back to school I continued to work for them, they worked my classes around my work. After college I went to work as a CO Installer, they planned on putting me in the management training program and I was in charge a lot after a few year, but each time I was asked about going into management they just demoted or fired someone, I just stayed where I was. After I retired I continued doing contract work and most of that time I have been lead, I still like to get my hands on the work, but most managers want me to make sure the job gets done. We don't have as much time to complete a job as in the early years, but most know that if the job gets messed up it will cost a lot more to fix it. Case in point, a company I was working for had to go into a job that had been done for Verizon, they had a crew working on a DSL hub and whoever was running the job was not watching how the cables had been ran, over a thousand cables had been installed backwards. It took 4 12 hour shifts for all the leads to come in a fix the job. The company got fired. Also years later you may have to go into a job you did and add to it, so you want it done neatly.

Reply to
Steven

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