bouncing connection and a netgear router..

Strider,

From your post, I gather that she has DSL service from her local phone company. Those DSL filters are suppose to filter out Internet packets so there is no interference with when making a phone call. What she needs to do is put the filter on the phone line, and then connect the phone onto the filter. For Internet connections, all she needs to do connect DSL modem straight to the phone line, router to the DSL modem, and finally computer to the router without any filters on it..

hope it helps.

Yes, she carries DSL from the local telco, namely Alltel. Her wiring is in good shape, she keeps filters on all the phone lines, and has the modem directly connected. Mainly, what I'm trying to do is establish that there isn't a problem with her router before we contact the local telco and request a line check up to the NID.

My main concern is that the bouncing only occurs in the use of streaming programs. Her wireless connection does not show the variances I have seen with Dlink's, which affects the whole connection in general. Use of Streaming apps, such as IM's and Internet Radio are the only things affected.

My strong belief is that it's an outside wiring issue, probably a bad slick card. She maintains the problems at all times, but it seems to amplify whenever moisture could be an issue (rain). So, before we run to Alltel crying foul, I want to ensure all other possible avenues have been checked.

Thats why I'm checking with everyone on here to see if anyone has encountered the issue before with this brand of router.

Thanks, Jon

snipped-for-privacy@plantationcable.net hath wroth:

I just love questions with absolutely no useful names and numbers. It add a challenge to troubleshooting. The following are rhetorical questions that you should ask yourself before blameing the DSL line.

- What model Netgear router?

- What hardware version of the Netgear router?

- Are you in the USA or elsewhere?

- Is the router firmware the latest? Are you sure it's the latest?

- What speed DSL line? What type of service (PPPoE, ADSL+, etc)?

- Have you had the ISP perform an ATM ping and line quality test?

- Have you checked the status page of the router for S/N ratio and signal level numbers? What does the status page say about the DSL line quality?

IM programs are normally NOT streaming. Streaming is playing MP3's, videos, and file sharing. A "bouncing" effect would seem to indicate that the connection is intermittently stopping and restarting. More questions:

- What exact operating system is the laptop using? What laptop?

- What exact "certain" programs is she using that have problems? Are there any streaming programs (itunes, Winamp, Real One, Google video, MS Media Player, etc) that do work as expected?

- What happens when she takes the wireless out of the picture and connects directly to the Netgear router with a CAT5 cable? Does "streaming" now work?

- Is the IM program with the problem doing VoIP or video?

- Have you done any download benchmarks and speed tests? Are the download and upload speeds roughly what the service is suppose to deliver? Try:

for the west coast of the USA. There are other servers listed with might be closer in other parts of the planet. Run the test with a directly connected (CAT5) cable, not the wireless. We're testing the DSL here, not the wireless link.

OK, we have Yahoo Messenger. I had the same problem with GAIM and Miranda IM and Yahoo Messenger. Loose a few packets and Yahoo says I'm disconnected. However, it doesn't actually log me off which requires logging back in. Does it really log her off, or just disconnect and reconnect constantly?

OK, now we have some clues. Can I deduce from this that it's ONLY the Yahoo Messenger client that's having a bad day and that everything else (web browsing, email, file transfers, file sharing, downloads, online games, and the wireless itself) are working normally?

Ummmm.... what's a "wireless spike"?

Clue: Not all Netgear routers are from the same manufactory in China. Different models and series of models use radically different chipsets and board designs. You can't say that they're all the same.

Incidentally, I did have a problem with flakey performance with a Netgear DG834 wireless router. I'm guessing that this is similar to what she has except she probably has a built in DSL modem model. I had to upgrade the firmware to get it to work reliably on a satellite link.

If I remember correctly, WGR614..but not 100% certain

Have to get back to u on that..

Southern USA

No, next step. Alltel is quick to blame in house items, so I'm checking it all b4 I call

No, I had a limited time between jobs last time. Focused mainly on the wiring and filters. Plan on heading back over there next weekend to double check everything b4 the call is made.

They are when she is using a cam, which she constantly does.

HP, not certain exact model, Win XP SP2

Right now, Yahoo IM and Pandora are the ones showing the prob.

I'll get her to try that tonite, and if she can't, I'll check it next weekend...

Disconnect and reconnect constantly. She stays connected on YIM chat boxes, but constant sign in/out and loss of camera feed. and sometimes (mostly noticed on rainy days) it will bounce enough to lock up the computer, forcing a reboot.

Just Yahoo and Pandora

Sorry, telco butting into my networking. A sudden drop in wireless signal, with a slow pickup. (think cruising at 54mg, suddenly dropping to 1mg, then 5.5, then 11, then 36, then 48, and finally back up to 54, all within a minutes time.)

Nope, seperate modem and router. But, that info really comes in handy.

I'll keep that in mind, because next week I'm installing a 3 line network for a local construction company that's using a satellite connection.

I'll be double checking the firmware and hardware next weekend when I can get back on site. Until then, I'm doing my research, finding out if anyone else has this prob, possible solutions, etc.

Her provider is notorious for automatically assuming inside wiring or added items are to blame. Which would mean a tech has to roll, which includes a site visit fee, repair fee, etc. Thats why I'm checking everything inside b4 a support call is made.

Thank you. Jon

Strider,

if you suspect that the wiring is the issue, then you can bypass the router by connecting the computer to the DSL modem; should the problem still continue then you can have the phone company check the line. Should the problem stop, then I would tell you then there probably some inference affecting your friend's router.

h> > Strider,

snipped-for-privacy@plantationcable.net hath wroth:

The WGR614 wireless router does NOT have a built in DSL modem. Look around for a box that's acting as a DSL modem. Also, there are 7 versions of the WGR614. They all look the same, but are quite different inside:

Actually, that's also been my experience. When a customer calls complaining of a flakey DSL connection, it all too common to find that they've added a phone somewhere and forgot to install a microfilter. Usually it's the CATV or DBS satellite set top box. Sometimes, it's a fax machine or fax/modem/printer/scanner combo. If her house has lots of phones and gadgets, think about installing a splitter at the MPOE (where the phone line enters the house), getting rid of the microfilters, and running a dedicated pair to the DSL modem.

That reminds me. Another all too common problem is the flat "station" wire between the DSL modem and the wall. I've found problems with such flat wires longer than about 15ft. The lack of twisted pairs and relatively high resistance seems to cause problems. (I'm not sure exactly why).

Set them up with some kind of DDNS (dynamic DNS) service so that you can ping them from your location. Ping the router, not the client machines. You can usually tell if something has gone weird or insane by the latency.

Touche. Y'er right. I use a camera with several programs. The level of quality and speed varies with the program. I've never bothered to see which is best or worst. As I vaguely recall, Yahoo Messenger video worked just fine on my 1500/384 DSL line. I also vaguely recall trying various programs when my line was 1500/128Kbit/sec. That didn't work very well at all. Check the outgoing bandwidth and make sure that there's nothing else (i.e. file sharing software, servers, spam, trojans, etc) that are consuming bandwidth.

I'm not familiar with Pandora. (I'll spare you the "out of the box" jokes).

It's important to determine if the problem is on the wireless or DSL end. It also might be a screwed up computah. The CAT5 test should at least partly eliminate the wireless. If there's another computer available, it might be worth trying. If you can bring another laptop, and wire it into the router with CAT5, you can run a file copy benchmark test between the 2nd laptop and her wireless laptop. That will give some indication of how well the wireless is doing. If it's unusually slow, then there's something wrong with the wireless part of the puzzle. If the laptop is fairly close to the WGR614 (not too close), you should get a 54Mbit/sec wireless connection which should yield about 25Mbits/sec TCP (file copy) thruput.

Also, have her try something really simple: Start -> run -> cmd ping 192.168.1.1 -t This will continuously ping the router from her laptop. With a wired connection, the latency should be zero and no packet loss. However, with a wired connection, it should be 1-2 msec and no lost packets. If the latency is mostly 1-2 msec but often increases to much larger delays, then she's getting interference from something.

Hmmm... I'm not sure what to make of that. Kinda sounds like the wireless is stopping intermittently causing the disconnections. If it disconnects long enough, it logs her out. I think taking the wireless out of the picture with CAT5 will settle that question.

Yeah, welcome to my pet peeve. I have both telco and CATV customers as clients. I have to change my language, acronyms, buzzwords, idiom, and jokes whenever I talk to these.

That could easily be interference. Tell me something about the laptop and its wireless card when you get the info. As I recall, the access point sets the speed. However, the ability to recover is totally dependent on the S/N ratio reported by the client. Therefore, a client that get clobbered by some bursty RF interference (like a microwave oven), will act like that.

Possible sources of RF interference:

Incidentally, I'm watching Skype announce that one of customers is online every 5 minutes or so. Up and down all day long. So, I login remotely to see what's wrong. He gets lots of email (likes to do his own spam filtering). For some odd reason, he was bouncing all his spam back to the source. Bad idea for various reasons. When his client checks for email and clogs the upstream on his DSL connection, Skype can't talk to the various user distributed directory servers and goes comatose for a while. When it comes back, it announces that it's back. It doesn't take much in the way of upstream bandwidth consumption to irritate some of these IM-like programs.

The DG834 is very different from the various WGR614 mutations. It's a beam steering router with a different Atheros chipset. The problems were apparently in the beam steering part of the router, which was fixed by the firmware update. In general, I rarely can buy a wireless device that has the latest firmware installed. I almost always have to update the firmware. Check to be sure.

3 line? You're back to telco-talk again. In computer geek talk, it's 3 client computers, or 3 workstations, or a 3 station workgroup.

If it's DirecWay/Hughesnet, it's fairly simple. The DW7000 terminal/router is quite simple and easy to deal with. One decision is whether to leave the DW7000 as an NAT router when attaching a 2nd router for wireless and end up with double NAT, or whether to disable the NAT router section of either the DW7000 or the wireless router. Methinks that could best be answered in the satellite specific newsgroup.

Weekend? Watch the overtime.

If the DSL modem has diagnostics, you can do much of the troubleshooting yourself. For example, the common SpeedStream/Efficient 5100b:

Sorry, been doing way too many cable installs lately. Losing touch with my roots...:)

Actually, Pandora is a music project. It's a self programming Internet Radio system. Go check it out at Pandora . com.

She's a friend, so it's an off the clock deal. Which is why I have to wait until next weekend... But, she does have satellite, and I forgot to check it for a filter, so thats another thing for the list...

Thanks, Jon