Real noob questions


I live in a small rural town in the backwoods. We have phoned
internet and a wireless provider.
The wireless antenna is about 800 meters away, i can see it
from the roof of my house. From the roof to my router (I use coyote on
a dial up) measures 4 meters.
From what I understand I will need an antenna, cable, a
pigtail and a pci wireless card.
So here are the questions:
Antenna -- would a simple wire antenna pointed at the source
be adequate ? Or one of these semi-parabolic antennas ? Like these :
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Cable - a lot of people here use RG 58, and say that at short
distances like 4 meters the loss is very small, 10% below a RG 213 .
Is this true ?
Pigtail - any secrets ? Do I need one if I use RG 58 ?
PCI wireless card - is there a cheap , good, all-operating
system chipset, like the realtek 8029-8129 are for ethernet ? I intend
to use it under linux and windows.
I've browsed dozens of pages, but most just sell. Few explain
anything at all.
TIA

Reply to
Shadow
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First ask the wireless provider what it takes to be a user.
Reply to
DTC
Shadow wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
As DTC said, you need to contact the provider to see what is required.
Just because it's wireless DOESN'T mean it is 802.11x. Many companies manufacture wireless systems that are proprietary, NOT 802.11. Take for example the Motorola Canopy 900 system....900 mHz and ABSOLUTELY NOT 802.11x.
Furthermore, it's MY opinion that any ISP that wants to be reliable, and appear to be not just another fly-by-night WISP, would NOT use commodity 802.11x gear.
Reply to
DanS
On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:37:17 -0200, Shadow wrote in :
Not necessarily -- you'll lose lots of signal in a 4 meter cable. That's pretty far, and you'll probably need to avoid signal losses. Better to use a USB, so no cable signal loss, and locate a USB wireless adapter and antenna where it has clear line of sight to the access point. Hawking makes a USB adapter with dish antenna that might be enough to get the job done. Otherwise use a USB adapter with external antenna connector and a high-gain directional antenna (e.g., bigger dish).
Reply to
John Navas
I did, it takes +- one months salary for an antenna, 10 meters of RG 58 cable, an old samsung wireless pci card.
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Monopoly is a wonderful thing, if you are on the other side. The guy hides as much tech details as possible, but I believe the control is done by MAC address. You get a 11kbps connection, for +- 1/10 of a months salary. This is slightly cheaper than the phone option. Also the phone is max 5 kbs. You have to give the equips back if you cancel the contract, plus the balance of one years fee, if you cancel before a year is up.
So I decided to try to set my own one up. See how strong the signal is, etc before signing up. No way I can hack here, pple would turn me in very soon. So no worries there. The questions stand.
(Sorry I use the expression "salary " instead of figures in dollars, or whatever. People have no idea how low salaries are in the third world)
Reply to
Shadow
Please see my reply to him about setup.
In this case, it is.
I understand that. We live in different worlds
?
Please read my other reply :( And if possible, reply to original questions :) []'s
A wireless howto anywhere ? All I found are more concerned with lap tops within the house, or wardriving. Nothing like the excellent linux ethernet howto.
Reply to
Shadow
On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 16:22:08 -0200, Shadow wrote in :
See wikis below. Let me know what you think is missing.
Reply to
John Navas
Not available here, also I cannot see the provider antenna from where I am, only from the roof.
Great links you sent. But ... they all think you are an expert in antennas ....
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This is supposed to be the easiest one, but there is no mention on how to connect it to PC or even how to point it .... []'s
Reply to
Shadow
On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 17:15:49 -0200, Shadow wrote in :
Check out Buffalo Tech.
I meant to put the USB adapter and antenna on the roof.
Reply to
John Navas
Granted its a monopoly, by definition where there is only one provider of service. He's a monopoly because there is no incentive for competition. As its HIS system, he has every right to be proprietary about it. Regardless what authentication he uses, its exclusively at his discretion on who he allows to use his service.
I really don't understand what you are saying. Even at the end of a long telephone loop, you can get at least an 18 kbps connection (unless there are sever line impairments - and you would definitely know that was clicks, pops, and squeals on a telephone call. Even a cheap Walmart internet account is on only $10 a month. So what you are saying doesn't make sense.
Annual commitments with an early termination fee are normal.
Be fore you even try that, you'll need to find out some very very basic points of his operation.
And what did you find out? Is he locked in at 802.11B or g? What authentication does he use (oops, you don't know that yet). 33 feet if RG58 cable, ummm...you need to study a bit more on cable losses.
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???? Why are you shopping in Australia?? Where are you from? Try a Linksys Wireless-G PCI Adapter
And if you ARE from Australia? The laws there are entirely different for wireless ISP operators. Are you sure he is operating a legal biz?
Reply to
DTC
On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 16:15:20 -0200, Shadow wrote in :
There's no real "monopoly" -- other Internet options undoubtedly exist (e.g., dialup, satellite, probably others). By that logic McDonalds has a "monopoly" on the Big Mac.
Reply to
John Navas
I'm almost giving up. I'll try to explain better: I live in the very interior of Brazil, in a far away rural town. I have a choice of a dialup or a wireless provider. Both are monopolies. I cannot buy stuff in USA, because taxes are very, very high, also because wages where you are almost 10 times ours. Multiply every price you see by 10 and you will see what price tags look like from here. He uses 80211.B as the link I posted to the NIC card shows. He uses MAC authentication. He uses an antenna like the one I posted a link to, also RG 58 cable. I know, because I examined my neighbors with a binocular and also asked about the cable. He transmits using 2.4 GHz In the place I work at, this guy also provides the same service. On a good, clear day it took me 10 hours to download the slackware CD1, about 600Mb. He sells that as a 22Kbps link. In my town its a 11Kbps link, so downloads would be around half as fast.. No one else was using the net and i did nothing else but download. I cannot examine the setup because he uses some kind of router on the roof and the signal enters via ethernet cable. If I take into account the salary differences, the guy wants 2000 dollars to lend me the antenna, cable and wireless PCI card, plus 250 dollars a month for the service.(a total of 3000 dollars a year, what I have to pay if I opt out). So if I could set up my end of the link, I would save a lot of money. I have downloaded a lot of docs though the links that John Navas posted, and will try to study them. Is there anything else you need to know ?
The questions stand:
Antenna -- would a simple wire antenna pointed at the source be adequate ? Or one of these semi-parabolic antennas ? Like these :
formatting link
formatting link
Cable - a lot of people here use RG 58, and say that at short distances like 4 meters the loss is very small, 10% below a RG 213 . Is this true ?
Pigtail - any secrets ? Do I need one if I use RG 58 ?
PCI wireless card - is there a cheap , good, all-operating system chipset, like the realtek 8029-8129 are for ethernet ? I intend to use it under linux and windows.
TIA
Reply to
Shadow
If its the only shop with a license to sell hamburgers in a town, there is no doubt about that. :) []'s
Reply to
Shadow
On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 22:18:10 -0200, Shadow wrote in :
Then they aren't. No such thing as two monopolies. You would have to argue duopoly, but even then there are probably other options.
In other words, you can, but choose not to.
I don't see the relevance.
Oh come on: Expansys Brazil sells the Linksys WRT54GS-US for about US $100
The going price in the USA is about US $70.
Reply to
John Navas
Open your mind. A dialup monopoly and a wireless monopoly.
Not available Disponibilidade: Descontinuado (need I say its just a "chamariz", a false offer ?)
50 dollars at newegg And a minimum salary here is now around 170 dollars a month. Is what > 80% of brazilians earn. But we diverge. Wrong newsgroup. I was just pointing out relative costs, which IS appropriate. No point in discussing what software to use on the new moon based super provider with 100GBs tranmission if neither of us will ever be able to afford it. []'s
Reply to
Shadow
And if it WAS available, there is a 60 dollar shipping + 200% import tax on it, not included in price. See mailing details. = 360 dollars []'s
Reply to
Shadow
Doesn't it come as a complete package?
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or
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Reply to
Kev
Edimax ew-7209apg
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Reply to
Kev
On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 08:23:00 -0200, Shadow wrote in :
Again, there is no monopoly.
Wrong link -- sorry -- correct link is
(as you would know had you bothered to check).
Nope, $70 (as I wrote):
Irrelevant.
At least get your facts/claims straight.
Reply to
John Navas
We are finally understanding each other :P A kit with the antenna in my question, using 8 meters(I only need 4 meters) of RG58 cable, and a ralink-chipset PCI card. And at a good price. So the questions stand : The kit comes with 8 meters of RG58 cable, and no pigtail. Is this OK ? The seller says that loss will be negligible. He also says that there is no problem using up to 15 meters of cable(a question low down on page) Are Zinwell G361 cards good quality ? Are they compatible with win/linux ? I have already visited the ralink site, it says the chipset, a ralink 2561T, has opensource drivers. Anyone tried one ? TIA
..............................................................................................................................
KIT CLIENTE DE PROVEDOR WIRELESS 100% HOMOLOGADO PELA ANATEL PRONTO PARA INSTALAR, CONTENDO:
- 01 antena PROELETRONIC 24 dBi (fique atento, existem antenas de menor preço, mas muitas nem mesmo são homologadas. TENHA GARANTIA DE QUALIDADE e perfeito funcionamento da sua rede wireless por anos e anos sem problemas com oxidação do dipolo e componentes e outros problemas que ocorrem em antenas de qualidade inferior).
- 01 Placa Pci Zinwell G361 802.11B/G 54 Mbps com chipset RALink 2561T
- 01 cabo para conexão da antena diretamente à placa, evitando assim o uso de pigtail e perda desnecessária do nível de sinal. O cabo tem 8 (oito) metros e já vai com os conectores montados. Montado com cabo RGC58 + conectores N femea e SMA.
Nota sobre o cabo RGC58: Muitas pessoas afirmam ERRONEAMENTE que o cabo RGC58 é muito inferior ao cabo RGC213 e que não funciona bem, causa perda, etc... ISSO É MITO. Em testes TÉCNICOS, que executamos, o cabo RGC58 apresentou inferioridade de 8% (OITO POR CENTO!!!) em relação ao cabo RGC213, ou seja, se você capta 70% de sinal com o RGC213, com o RGC58 você irá ter uma perda de 8%, captando apenas 65% de sinal, o que praticamente não influencia na velocidade de conexão. Quem realmente entende de wireless sabe analisar e comprovar a situação. O cabo RGC58 é o melhor custo x benefício do mercado, além de ser infinitamente mais fácil de trabalhar do que o RGC213.
Se você não conhece as conexões diretas com cabo RGC58, EXPERIMENTE !

Especificação da antena:
HOMOLOGAÇÃO ANATEL Nº 0337-05-2250
Modelo: MM-2425Z Antena Parábola Grade Internet/MMDS 25 dBi
Compatível com: MMDS / Internet / Wi-Fi / Links Freqüência: 2.4 GHz (2.35 a 2.65 GHz) Ganho: 25 dBi Isolação de polarização: >30dB VSWR: < 1.5 F/B: > 25 dB
Conector: "N" Fêmea ou "N" Macho Material: Aço Acabamento: Zincagem Medida Antena: 0,665 x 0,800

Especificação da Placa Zinwell G361
Com chipset RALINK 2561
ZINWELL - HOMOLOGAÇÃO ANATEL: 0024-05-2490
* Radio Technology: - IEEE 802.11b Direct Sequence Spread Spectrum (DSSS) * - IEEE 802.11g Orthogonal Frequency Division Multiplexing (OFDM) Interface: 32-bit PCI 2.1, 2.2. Bus Master * Data Transfer Rate: 1, 2, 5.5, 6, 9, 11, 12, 18, 24, 36, 48, 54Mbps (auto sense) * Receiver Sensitivity: - 54Mbps: Typical -73dBm @ 10% PER (Packet Error Rate) - 11Mbps: Typical -85dBm @ 8% PER (Packet Error Rate) * Transmit Rate - 802.11g: 12dBm typically - 802.11b: 15dBm typically * Frequency Range: 2412 ~ 2484 MHz ISM band (channels 1 ~ 14) * Modulation Schemes: DBPSK/DQPSK/CCK/OFDM * Channels: 1~11 channels (FCC), 1~13 channels (ETSI), 1~14 channels (MKK-Japan) * Media Access Protocol: CSMA/CA with ACK * Security: 64/128-bits WEP Encryption, WPA * Diagnostic LED: LNK (Link status) * Antenna: 2 dBi Dipole Antenna * Driver Support: Windows 98se, Windows 2000, Windows ME, Windows XP * Continuous Current Consumption: 240mA typ. for receive mode, 530mA typ. for transmit mode * Temperature Operating: 0° ~ 40° C, Storage: -10° ~ 70° C * Humidity: 10% ~ 95% RH, no condensation * Dimensions: 133 x 121 x 21.6 mm (without antenna) * Certifications: ANATEL , FCC Part 15.247 for US, ETS 300 328 for Europe
Reply to
Shadow

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