Just for discussion.

One question leading to one very remote possibility is: Does the CS telephone number have nines and or ones in it?

Another question leading to another remote possibility is" I'm thinking that if it's a DTMF line that it probably also has rotary dial capability. Land lines are becoming more and more of a problem as the telcos ignore them and as they try to switch everyone to fiber or cellular.

Maybe an intermittent connection (?) coincedently and ultimately dialed 911. Any crackling or static on the line?

And ya know? I've always had this bad feeling about tomatoes. Ya know? Just something about them -------

But celery on the other hand -------

Hi Jim, I did not hear any crackling or static on the line. But, then again I am on the deaf side of things with high frequency hearing loss. However, it is something I should check with a different ear sometime.

I did ask the question about the back numbers to 911. Was told that there were at least 10 or so that would get there. Was not told what they were. Either way with just a Fax and the Fire panel connected to the line it does seem a bit odd for a 3 digit or a

10 digit number to be dialed in some way to get through. Tomato or no tomato. ;-)

Les

I'd blame the local telco, I had one here which cross connected over a hundred lines from 2 different towns. Talk about old style party lines...... It seemed that the 2 towns were serviced by the same telco switch house.. An in-house cable upgrade was the cause, they had cross connected the lines when changing out the old cable and the tech "forgot" to remove the old cable from the ckts.. (or so they said) LOL

RTS

Yes, good point Rocky, I have been in buildings that have had phone company punch down blocks with Teclo lines there that were for another building. The numbers were totally unrelated to the in house business. Telco just used it as a splice block for the area.

So it is possible that the same may be possible here. In that the actual Fax number is landed some where else and easily accessible by anybody. I will bring that up if/when the issue comes up again at this particular site. So far, it's be almost a week and all is good.

**Could change in a heart beat.........................

Les

might also request a reverse caller ID on the incoming calls for that time frame.. We've found several "kiddie" calls over the years that way..

Not sure what you mean by "reverse Caller ID" Isn't that what County Control did to find out where the call came from??

I've been in a lot of businesses like that. Where the entire cable down an alley is brought into every building on that street. Its annoying as hell, but it does allow for easier redistribution of resources as businesses change. It also allows for savy people to eavesdrop on conversations and/or steal service with little effort. I don't recall the details, but some couple decades ago there was a federal regulation change that phone companies had to make it easier for fed to execute wiretaps. I don't recall all the details, but that was around the same time I stared seeing a lot of 50 and 100 pair cables looped into new buildings and new plant improvements projects. I always thought the two were connected. With the newer digital CO switches I always wondered why they just didn't have a data link into the COs. Some rural exchanges still had mechanical switches at the time though.

On 7/20/2020 8:12 PM, ABLE1 wrote: > On 7/20/2020 9:58 PM, RTS wrote: >> On 7/20/2020 6:06 PM, ABLE1 wrote: >>> On 7/20/2020 12:12 PM, RTS wrote: >>>> On 7/20/2020 7:19 AM, ABLE1 wrote: >>>>> On 7/20/2020 12:51 AM, Jim Davis wrote: >>>>>> On Sunday, July 19, 2020 at 1:20:58 PM UTC-4, ABLE1 wrote: >>>>>>> Hello all, no matter how few!! :-) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The other day I received a call from a customer that said that >>>>>>> morning a police officer showed up and asked if there was a problem. >>>>>>> The office manager said; "No, I just got here at the office 20 >>>>>>> minutes >>>>>>> ago. The officer said; "County Control received a call from a phone >>>>>>> number here with no one on the other end when answered." >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Turns out the number that called 911 was their Fax number. I was >>>>>>> called >>>>>>> to investigate what may have happened. The Fax number is also >>>>>>> used for >>>>>>> the Line #2 to the Fire Panel. The line used is a POTS line and >>>>>>> there >>>>>>> is an outside Demarc. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> After it was determined that it was the Fax the Office Manager >>>>>>> turned >>>>>>> the machine off. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> When I arrived I checked the line and all was as it should be. Only >>>>>>> two devices connected to the line, Fax and Fire Panel. I tested >>>>>>> the line to my cell to verify the number. I checked the Demarc and >>>>>>> all looked and worked as it should. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I connected my Butt Set at the Fax Machine and put on speaker. >>>>>>> Turned >>>>>>> it on and nothing. Then sent a Fax to my office, Ok. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I called the County Control Center and talked to a Supervisor who >>>>>>> verified just one call at 7:51am. He had their Tech Guy call me >>>>>>> later. Basically we determined it to be an unsolved mystery. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Although I did express a theory that would fit the scenario. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> =============================================================== >>>>>>> A teenage snot that just wanted to have fun took a old corded >>>>>>> phone and opened up the Demarc box and plugged into the first >>>>>>> port. Dialed 911 and after the first ring hung up. Closed >>>>>>> the box and hid behind a bush snickering. >>>>>>> ============================================================== >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Tech Guy liked that 'maybe' but then told me a true story about >>>>>>> a tomato. Officer was dispatched a house with a active number that >>>>>>> called 911. Approached and asked the lady of the house who was out >>>>>>> in her garden if everything was ok?? She said yes, why?? >>>>>>> Officer explained and they went into the house to check the phone. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What was found was a tomato sitting on the window sill far to long, >>>>>>> had started to leak juice. The juice trail went down the wall and >>>>>>> onto the phone sitting below. Juice got into the phone and shorted >>>>>>> out the 9 & 1 on the DTMF pad and made the call. WOW!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Tomato and phone were placed in the trash bin. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Ok, that is the start of the discussion. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Anyone care to contribute?? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Les >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> One question leading to one very remote possibility is: >>>>>> Does the CS telephone number have nines and or ones in it? >>>>>> >>>>>> Another question leading to another remote possibility is" >>>>>> I'm thinking that if it's a DTMF line that it probably also has >>>>>> rotary dial capability. >>>>>> Land lines are becoming more and more of a problem as the telcos >>>>>> ignore them and as they try to switch everyone to fiber or cellular. >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe an intermittent connection (?) coincedently and ultimately >>>>>> dialed 911. Any crackling or static on the line? >>>>>> >>>>>> And ya know? I've always had this bad feeling about tomatoes. Ya >>>>>> know? >>>>>> Just something about them ------- >>>>>> >>>>>> But celery on the other hand ------- >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi Jim, >>>>> I did not hear any crackling or static on the line. >>>>> But, then again I am on the deaf side of things with high frequency >>>>> hearing loss. However, it is something I should check with a >>>>> different ear sometime. >>>>> >>>>> I did ask the question about the back numbers to 911. Was told that >>>>> there were at least 10 or so that would get there. Was not told >>>>> what they were. Either way with just a Fax and the Fire panel >>>>> connected to the line it does seem a bit odd for a 3 digit or a >>>>> 10 digit number to be dialed in some way to get through. >>>>> Tomato or no tomato. ;-) >>>>> >>>>> Les >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> I'd blame the local telco, >>>> I had one here which cross connected over a hundred lines from 2 >>>> different towns. >>>> Talk about old style party lines...... >>>> It seemed that the 2 towns were serviced by the same telco switch >>>> house.. >>>> An in-house cable upgrade was the cause, they had cross connected the >>>> lines when changing out the old cable and the tech "forgot" to remove >>>> the old cable from the ckts.. (or so they said) LOL >>>> >>>> RTS >>> >>> Yes, good point Rocky, >>> I have been in buildings that have had phone company punch down blocks >>> with Teclo lines there that were for another building. The numbers were >>> totally unrelated to the in house business. Telco just used it as a >>> splice block for the area. >>> >>> So it is possible that the same may be possible here. In that the >>> actual Fax number is landed some where else and easily accessible by >>> anybody. I will bring that up if/when the issue comes up again at this >>> particular site. So far, it's be almost a week and all is good. >>> >>> **Could change in a heart beat......................... >>> >>> Les >> might also request a reverse caller ID on the incoming calls for that >> time frame.. >> We've found several "kiddie" calls over the years that way.. >> --- >> We also had a "fellow" alarm dealer, who retreaded several old dialer's >> (DD-1's, DD-3's) >> and didn't delete the second page of dialer programming.. >> (seems they were using the old accounts numbers again) >> Well needless to say we also had several "odd" alarm reports.. >> We also found those with the reverse Caller ID ... >> >> RTS > > > Not sure what you mean by "reverse Caller ID" Isn't that what > County Control did to find out where the call came from??

I don't know what reversed call ID is, but back in the early 90s (maybe late 80s) Enhanced 911 with full account information became the norm. Police received name, address, number, etc from all incoming 911 calls. They did not receive that from calls on their non emergency dispatch numbers. Only 911 calls. Its also why every cell in the USA is required to have a GPS now. It turns on automatically when you call

911. Mine turns on sometimes on its own. I try to always leave it turned off unless I am using a mapping service for directions.

When the Internet became mainstream and just about everybody still had a landline there were reverse phone lookup services that actually worked (for free). You could punch in a number and they would search white pages to find the name on the account. I used it a number of times to hunt down and identify errant signals coming in on my toll free CS lines. I sometimes had to wait for my toll free bill to arrive to make sure I had the right number. it didn't always match the call ID, or the call ID didn't always go through to the CS.

Hi Bob, Thanks for the extra Tidd Bits, I just knew you would contribute some good stuff!! It would seem that we ALL have seen the loop holes. I had a day "waaaaay back" that I was out in the country and no payphones around and I needed to make a phone call. I was soooooo tempted to pop open Demarc on the nearest house, hook up my Butt Set and make the call. BUT, I controlled myself!!!! I am sure I wasn't the first to have the thought. I am sure it has happened..... somewhere!!

Les

(( gonna let the cat out of the bag, yes you are... )) LOL HeHe, Les, I always carry a butt set.. ((and I'm suppose to be retired)))

may be the same thing. (The phone guys, way back when, always gave us the "evil-eye" unless we requested the "Reverse" Caller ID..

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I've had to do it a few times through the years. But I left a quarter in th e mail box.

(NOT!;-)

It doesn't help of course that you can buy a butt set at Home Depot or Lowes these days.

Absolute agreement!!! Which adds to the scenario I posed being a possibility!! :-)

There is another more sinister if probably unlikely possibility. The cops wanted a look around and made it up. How legit is the client?

Remember it is not against the law for them to lie to you.

LOL Really?? The cops will/can actually do that?? I see the makings of a new movie.................. I guess anything is possible...............

BTW This Fax (number) is in a local town borough office.

Les

Yep. They can and will although usually you only hear about it in an interrogation. Sometimes they will do it to try and get you to doubt your own memory. "Oh, I've been with the department since 19xx, and no officer by that name ever existed. Certainly not at the rank and position you claim." No shit.

Bob, Hmmmmmmm sounds like you were on the wrong end of the stick. And you remember it well!! Sorry to hear. It is too bad that kind of stuff has to happen.

But, then again it is unlikely it will never change given the condition of the human psychic. We can wish for better, doesn't mean we will ever get it. Years ago I had purchased some furniture from a guy I worked with. Found out later that he was arrested for property theft.

I reported to State Police that I had two pieces and wanted to get them out of my apartment. Was asked by the officer on the case to come to the police barracks to make the report. Turns out that two detectives started to imply that I was involved in the theft or I should have known the furniture was hot because of the low price that paid. It was about time my button got pushed. I gave them a piece of my mind, demanded that they get the furniture removed from my apartment and walked out. I ended up calling again in two weeks and told the detective that if the stuff was not picked up that day I was going to put it out in the parking lot and they can come by at any time to get it. He was there within the hour. Ended up as a witness for the prosecution and had to sit outside the courtroom for 3 days counting bricks on the wall. '763' He pleaded guilty to a lesser charge or something. Huge PITA!!!

Yes, I remember it well!!

As well as a very few other police moments in my life. Some I won, some not so much. All minor issues. As I understand the "statutes of limitations" have expired. ;-)

Les

Actually I was first told about lying to people as a matter of course in class at ALETA. Since then I've stood there and listened to COPs lie to people (and a couple times to me) while I just mentally shook my head.

The worst part is if you lie to them during the course of their official duties you can be charged for it. (never happened to me) Its best to remain silent.

Just google (or bing if you prefer) Are The Police Allowed To Lie?