CCTV at night

one wireless miniature camera attached, I did this

fine but has a range of about 20m instead of the 100m

cameras to it (3 more spare ports) but the dealer

chunky and I like the discrete miniature type. Is

lighting? The dealer says you can't do this, you need the

The dealer is wrong. You can use a separate IR illuminator. Unfortunately, the ones with enough power to illuminate a long distance tend to be costly.

Depending on how big or small a "chunky" camera is, here's a link for you...

Without the sun shield, this camera is about 1.5" - 2" in diameter. If you can find one that has a black case instead of the silver one here, it would be much more discrete.

I found this one through a quick google search, although I believe I've used this model with good results too. Just beware, the infrared illuminators will generally only work well within a 30 foot range.

You don't need cameras with built-in IR illuminators, but you do need cameras that can pick up the IR illumination. As Bass noted though, large high-power illuminators can be expensive.

How about just using a motion-activated flood light? Your mini-cams will be a lot happier with that, and you'll be a lot more likely to simply scare the bad guys away with that.

Thanks very much. I know its easy to go overboard with security systems, the fact is, I just want to protect a few valuables I have in the house, so IR range isn't important. FYI, I live in an old house that is historically listed, I am not allowed to fit heavy duty security equipment; and I want to keep the CCTV small and wireless. I called the local police crime prevention dept, they said CCTV is a waste of time and money, I'd be better off fitting good locks. this sounds stupid to me - why fit expensive locks to doors when you can push you elbow through a window? I just want a good picture that will stand up in court. Its difficult to know what to do living in an old house that you can't alter and too far away for an audio alarm to be of any significant use.

I enjoy reading the cross talk, there's a lot of good information passed on this group.

Charlie Brown

I agree. The motion floods are the "better idea". Quartz-halogen floods will allow you to employ color cameras (rather than black and white) which will make identifying the "perps" easier for the Police.

If you want covert surveillance though, infra-red illuminators are the only way to go. They're cost increases with the distance to the object. Using a cheap camera with them isn't going to avail you much, however. You'll "see" a blurry object wielding another blurry object trying to get into what appears to be your blurry back door. :-)

You can use separate IR illuminators but most IR illuminators are anything but discreet, also most manufacturers seem to exaggerate the range of their IR products especially the lower end products. Depending on the amount of ambient light, there may be other options such as using a very low light level camera.

Doug

Correction: "Their" ...

Hey Charlie,

Well pe> Hi

As Matt suggested, a motion detector light may be a good solution. Speco makes a decent one that looks and works just like any other motion-operated flood light. However, located inside the unit is a hidden CCTV camera. I've used these and they work well. Thieves are used to seeing motion-lights and they won't even guess that they're on Candid Camera. Heck, they might even look straight at the light when it comes on.

If the historical society doesn't get all bent out of shape about it you could probably fit one of these on the side of each house behind a downspout or chimney and another under the eaves in the back. A

4-channel video card for your PC might be a decent substitute for an expensive DVR if you've got a decent sized HD in the 'puter.

No one seems to have remembered to mention that not only are "inexpensive" cameras not going to give you a good night picture ..... they also don't have "day/night" capability. Even good color cameras don't do too good at night, even with infra red illuminators. Mfg's produce cameras that will convert to black and white cameras at night. Black and white cameras detect infra red illimination much better than color cameras. In some cases giving you much more than a two fold better picture than a color camera. Also, even "day/night" cameras have a problem of staying in focus in both the day and the night conditions. Better cameras provide compensation for this.

I do cameras .... but truthfully .... I don't think they have much value. Usually you just wind up with a video of a complete stranger breaking into your house. No one will ever identify him. You can only hope that if the police keep the video that someday they may catch someone and remember that he's on your tape.

In my opinion ....your best bet is good lighting, good locks, make your home look occupied when it's not, some lawn signs or window stickers and a reasonable security system. Then if you want to add some video .... go for it.

You are all a great group of guys willing to help out us non techy people. I am willing to spend whatever it takes balanced against what is reasonable. It is annoying that advice is not easy to get from the institutions; the insurance companies are not in the slightest bit interested if you try your best using modern technology, it seems the old adage of bolt your doors and keep your head down still applies.

thanks

take a look at

Yup... and again, when a big bright light comes on in his face, the "perp" is a lot more likely to simply leave, BEFORE doing any damage.

makes a decent one that looks and works just like any

hidden CCTV camera. I've used these and they work well.

they're on Candid Camera. Heck, they might even look

Ooooo I like that idea.

Yeah, I think part of the police skepticism comes from the numerous "cheap" systems out there, in use mostly by homeowners and cheap-ass businesses, that record low-res, low-quality video from tiny camreas with cheap plastic wide-angle lenses to time-lapse VHS tape using cheap tapes on cheap transports, ending up with video that's pretty much useless. Put a couple of bucks into the system, and you can get plenty of useful video out of it.

A "good" basic "pro" camera will run you a couple hundred bucks, with another $50-$100 for a "good" lens. How much do you really expect to get from a "complete four-cameras-with-TV-and-built-in-recorder" package that costs $200 at Costco?

Don't they have one that uses a receiver and transmits the video over the electrical wires?

Cameras have their uses but not high in the priority of things. Look at the two example links. In the 1st one, the camera really did nothing. The house owner got a call from the auto dialer. Obviously the security system detected the intruders, not the cameras. He call the police when he saw the thieves on camera. 12 cameras? You can have a very reliable system for much cheaper, and can pay for a monitoring service here in US. Relying on yourself to receive the phone and call the police isn't that reliable.

The 2nd example is bad if you have any valuable to protect. The 1st priority is to deter, detect and scare intruders away before they can do anything. A fairly simple alarm system will do. As some say, you need a decent camera and recorder to catch real thieves - not those tiny CMOS camera, even worse for night vision camera. You have to understand in that part of the world, they are stealing a 21 inch curved screen TV, and perhaps a toaster. In that case, a tiny camera may work, but it just serve to capture the face of a local thief well known to the local police.

My opinion is that camera is really deterrent for business who have to let everybody into their premises. And for perimeter security to deter potential thieves and vandalism. It's difficult to avoid false alarm outdoors.

To protect the windows, simple magnetic detector will do. And if you are serious, vibration glass detectors or better, acoustic detectors turned to the breaking sound of glass. Then PIR indoor is almost fail safe, unless you have a pet roaming around in the same room. If an alarm doesn't scare the thieves away, they can always smash your camera and your recorder, unless you have some sort of internet camera with remote file server to store the images.

Most security can be battery operated, but cameras are two high powered for batteries. In California they can just turn off the main switch at the front of my house.

Back to night vision CCTV. Firstly, trying to catch them in the act is dangerous thinking when you can deter them, keep them away, and scare them away.

Size is everything. Those miniature cameras are really bad. In daylight it's OK. At night all you can see are silhouettes. Night vision means they take away the IR filter for ordinary use, and add IR LED's. They are big and some actually emit faint red lights for all to see. I have a 12 LED IR light that looked like a small poor ordinary torch. I've seen 36 and 72 high power LED's. A 50 W light bulb with an ordinary camera looked better than a cheap 12 LED IR light. So an PIR controlled flood light is cheaper, lower power consumption, and have better images.