34. Is monitoring required?

oh,,, you are SUCH an idiot.

he's brilliant ain't he! sheeeeeeeeeesh.

| > First, i prefer a silent alarm approach : | >

| > Think it over. | >

| > Paul | > | | |

NO monitoring is not required just like dyers do as good the installation job than "so called" pro's. Too many false alarms have lead police to a point that they lower the intervention priority of alarm calls. Where is the benefit to have monitoring?

Initially the cause of police complains about false alarms was that the systems where installed by non pro's, not reliable they said.. Did the pro's installations improve false alarms, i think so when it boils down to selecting the appropriate type of sensor (dog present, sunshine,..), but you can have recommendations/advises also, so why would a pro installation be better when it boils down to false alarm system reliability ?

You can make a parallel between installation knowledge and monitoring, why should you need them?

Let's see how i handle my alarms without monitoring ?

First, i prefer a silent alarm approach :

- i don't see who allows himself to involve external persons not directly involved with a noisy sound/flashlight outside. There is already enough unwanted noise around; Its no longer an alarm system according to law when those external devises are not present, Dyer's welcome.

- i prefer several low volume buzzers, located at multiple places inside my house, in order to inform the intruder that he has been detected. There are enough spare wires in the cables to the sensors to provide the required alarm signal to small buzzers all around the protected area's.

- i let the system rings directly to my cell phone. If i like to have my neighbor's involved, i give them a personal call and explain them the ongoing problem. At least i will know who is involved to observe the surrounding and who look if the police are arriving. No direct intervention;

- second, i let the system call back hiss own phone-line who will be busy of course (see below for more details).

Is a monitoring station required ? The usual arguments of monitoring stations are that they are available all the time and that you will not receive the alarm call all the time. Well yes and no..

How do i attempt to solve that? When an alarm is detected it dial my cell phone and the place where the alarm is originated from, my home. Why ? Well when i'm not reachable for action (at the theater for instance or for any other reason) i redirect my alarm phone-line "conditionally" (when the line is busy) to an alternative person who agree to take action. When an alarm goes on, my alarm phone-line is busy, so it redirects.

Why do i not change the phone number in the alarm control panel to redirect the call? Redirection by means of a phone is less error risky, it can be done :

- with my home-phone in a semi-automatic manner, the redirection/cancel data is included and stored in the phone number to call;

- from my cell phone at any time and place;

So, is monitoring required? Do they do a better job whit theyre standard procedures? Is outside warning (yelling and flashing devices) mandatory? Are very noisy sirens inside required to disturb intruders?

Well it depends on your choice and how good you will feel afterwards about the selected solution. How good will you feel when you select an all included out of your control handling or your personal intervention when there is an alarm going on. Think it over.

Paul

This cure efficiently "finger troubles" too.

I think it's much better to give an explanation to this issue rather than sending down the drain. Firstly, the external siren has three main objectives: a- To protect the property prior to any attempt of entry. A "bad" person would not enter a home or office with a siren installed. He/she would rather go to a home/office without a security system installed. b- To alert the neighbours and other primary action teams of which you have asked for assistance earlier on. c- To direct any type of action force (police, private security guards, etc.) to the premises with ease. Following the sound and the flasher helps find the home/office in complicated areas much easier.

Secondly, in reliance to why we need monitoring services. The main issue is of course the marketing aspect. You keep your customer satisfied and by means of CRM are able to add more customers to your references. If you are a company that does not give after sales support then you are bound to loose heaps of money in the first place. You are the type of company that goes from door to door and gives a thousand pack of "lies" to sell the equipment. Where as a company that uses CRM and other tools such as monitoring are always interconnected with their customers, meaning the automatic addition of new potential clients. There are many monitoring stations that reduce the amount of false alarms leaving only the true potential ones for any action to be involved. But where as a dialer system sends an alarm no matter what. And you must attend these alarms as you have no detail of the situation. A neighbour to a system with a dialer would go ahead nad check the system once, maybe twice but after two false alarms he/she would get the impression that "... Opps, there goes Rogers shitty system again..." and would not act at all to the system. I guess that you do not understand the full benefits of an alarm monitoring station Paul. It would be a good idea that you go to one and understand what other types of services are actually given. Services such as the in-depth usages of early/late open/close monitoring, test signals and the meaning of cross zone alarms, duress alarms, etc. I could go on for hours trying to explain the benefits of an alarm monitoring station but I fully reccommend that you go to one and have detailed information before you have any other "funny" ideas.

Never the less you must always consider that if a "PRO" is using monitoring services and "Amatuers" do not (which is not always the case), then there must be something lying behind it that makes the "PRO"s better in marketing, sales and all other comercial issues.

After 4 years of endless dribble, we can safely say that Paul's brain is still not immune to RFI. It's time to take the headphones off Paul. Maybe one of us "PROS" can send you a tin foil lined hat to block all the unwanted RFI.

Yes Paul, there is a life beyond RFI...

Jim Rojas

Actually...if I were replying to a rational person you may be correct. However, Paulie (pull@shoot) is a f****ng wacko troll, when he goes off his medications or when the asylum lets him out un-supervised (usually on weds/thurs) he comes here to bother us with ridiculous statements. Then he'll backup his statements with url's to technical pages that have nothing to do with his statement. He's a gnat.

This has been happening in NY for a few years now. Not just State Farm but a few other too.

Not the "mandatory" part( to my knowledge) but the confirmation at every renewal that monitoring is still being provided.

There are good reasons to select monitoring, whether the installation is professional or DIY. In the event a fire is detected while the owners are out, the fire department will be notified much sooner, possibly saving the house. When carbon monoxide is detected and authorities are notified lives can be saved. With burglary, the *possibility* that the system is being monitored may cause the thief to leave sooner. In reality, very few thieves are captured due to alarm monitoring because it almost always takes longer for police to be notified and respond than for the thief to get away. There are other situations where monitoring can make a difference. A homeowner may need to signal for help and there isn't time to make a phone call.

For the alarm company there is one very good reason to sell monitoring. Once the company is sells enough accounts monitoring revenue is its largest profit center.

I have heard of this when they are writing insurance covering contents. I also have been getting called by insurance companies. lately (State Farm being the most consistant) which we submitted info to on behalf of our clients. They want to find out if the client is still being monitored or if the client has cancelled the monitoring. It is happening on renewal and I am sure that it has to do with the alarm credit. If a customer cancels, we automatically notify the insurance company of the cancellation. I don't want to be the "alarm company of record" if something happens after the fact.

We do the same thing. Also, it's difficult to get insurance on a business without monitored alarm out here.

| > Jim Rojas | >

| >

| > > There are good reasons to select monitoring, whether the installation is | > > professional or DIY. In the event a fire is detected while the owners | are | > > out, the fire department will be notified much sooner, possibly saving | the | > > house. When carbon monoxide is detected and authorities are notified | > > lives can be saved. With burglary, the *possibility* that the system is | > > being monitored may cause the thief to leave sooner. In reality, very | few | > > thieves are captured due to alarm monitoring because it almost always | > > takes longer for police to be notified and respond than for the thief to | > > get away. There are other situations where monitoring can make a | > > difference. A homeowner may need to signal for help and there isn't | time | > > to make a phone call. | > >

| > > For the alarm company there is one very good reason to sell monitoring. | > > Once the company is sells enough accounts monitoring revenue is its | > > largest profit center. | > >

| > > -- | > >

| > > Regards, | > > Robert L Bass | > >

| > > =============================>

| > > Bass Home Electronics | > > 2291 Pine View Circle | > > Sarasota · Florida · 34231 | > > 877-722-8900 Sales & Tech Support | > >

| > >

| >

| >

| | |

Statefarm and a few others here in Florida are making it manditory in some cases to have monitoring.

Jim Rojas

I had a customer sign up for monitoring, and they had a policy with Statefarm. The customer never paid me even when I contacted the customer numerous times. I then cancelled all 3 of their accounts after 6 months of non payment. I then sent cancellation notices to Statefarm with a reason why.

Statefarm then cancelled all their policies. All this happened shortly after the huge storms hit Florida. When the customer tried to get new policies elsewhere, they were faced with 3 times the original cost of what they were paying Statefarm initially.

After several weeks of begging and pleading to renew their policies by the customer, both Statefarm and I stood our ground. To this day, they have yet to offer to pay any back monitoring.

What can I say?

Jim Rojas

Well, sure...that makes tons of sense...what the hell are you trying to say?

A dummy or a real siren, both help.

True but in practice who care? Anyhow you are right, its a mater of choice with unpredictable efficiency.

True you are right, but what about central stations who don't have all that marvelous help?

What are the selection criteria's???

My alarm is associated with phone speech who mention the sensor/alarm type involved.

Probably true.. The solution is to have a silent alarm and personal contact.

True i don't know the benefits but instead i know what i have when i'm in charge of monitoring and that is the most important to me.

Thanks, it are not ideas but its a real solution to get writ of un personalized monitoring. By the way, i have room listing capability on alarm in my home and i know the voice of the persons who can have made a finger trouble, they can explain...

There are a lot of things in this world who are convenient, a pro can't offer what i suggested: self monitoring.

I don't say that monitoring is useless, i just don't thrust it. Experience (???): 3 alarms on a monitored system where i was contacted because i was on "THE" fix list.

As i mentioned before i still think that self monitoring is feasible and reliable.

Regards

WHEN you have an automated alarm system. Conditions (sound and light show) where mentioned before.

I could offer you a lot of other things that are equally bad or worse than self monitoring .........But I wouldn't do that. My goal would be to offer you that which has a proven history of success.

And THAT's a reason to not trust monitoring by a central station? Who's system was it? Was the system maintained properly? Was it used with care by the owner? If it were your system and it went off three times, would you want the people with whom you entrusted response to, to respond? Even if it ultimately turned out to be false? Do you expect that no alarm system is ever going to be tripped falsely? After it went off three times, did you find out why it tripped? Did someone just PUT you on a list or were you asked to be on it? If the system continued to false alarm, and wasn't being taken care of ....... did you ask to be removed from the list? Also ........With self monitoring, how do you tell the difference from a real alarm and a false alarm? If it goes off three times and you are called ....... will you then also give up self monitoring as being unreliable?

If you can't see your misconceptions in that statement ....... then you really do deserve to monitor your own system.

And good luck .......... too.

That's nothing new. Insurers have required high end residences as well as many high risk commercial establishments to have monitored alarms for many years. The extent of coverage requirements vary from one underwriter to the next though.

Jim the reason Paul was on the FIX list is he hadn't paid for monitoring in 9 months. :-)...there's always a reason things don't get fixed...

client doesn't want to pay for service that they think should be free. client is only home between 2am and 4 am client never answers the phone or returns calls for service scheduling. client is a freekin idiot like Paulie client said he'd replace the batteries because he didn't want to pay for service and never did replace them...

blah blah blah...

and of course anything that happens to Paulie the Parrot is someone else's fault...not responsiblilty on his part. Prime example is he spends 4 years "researching" wireless alarms AFTER he buys a piece of crap and it fails on him (if any of his whining is true that is)

| > I don't say that monitoring is useless, i just don't thrust it. | > Experience (???): 3 alarms on a monitored system where i was contacted | > because i was on "THE" fix list. | | And THAT's a reason to not trust monitoring by a central station? Who's | system was it? Was the system maintained properly? Was it used with | care by the owner? If it were your system and it went off three times, | would you want the people with whom you entrusted response to, to | respond? Even if it ultimately turned out to be false? Do you expect | that no alarm system is ever going to be tripped falsely? After it went | off three times, did you find out why it tripped? Did someone just PUT | you on a list or were you asked to be on it? If the system continued to | false alarm, and wasn't being taken care of ....... did you ask to be | removed from the list? | Also ........With self monitoring, how do you tell the difference from | a real alarm and a false alarm? If it goes off three times and you are | called ....... will you then also give up self monitoring as being | unreliable? | | >

| > As i mentioned before i still think that self monitoring is feasible | > and reliable. | | If you can't see your misconceptions in that statement ....... then you | really do deserve to monitor your own system. | | > | > Regards | | And good luck .......... too. | |