Fire Lite MS5UD??

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Hello all,

Has anyone here installed the Fire Lite MS5UD??

I have one installed.  Not my panel of choice, it was a replacement
for an existing panel that had gone south for a new customer.

It is set up for monitoring (two POTS lines) with 24 hour test.
The problem I am having is that it does a double daily test.

It is testing each line daily.

Can't seem to find a way to make it just do one daily test.
Anyone here have a fix for this.  Called tech support
and all I get is yes that is the way it is and there is
no way to change it.

Any thoughts would be helpful.

Thanks,

Les

Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On 1/19/2017 10:37 AM, ABLE1 wrote:
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Les  I don't have a manual in front of me at the moment,
But I think  the double report has something to do with the way the  
lines are programmed..  ie.. one master other backup  or  both master..
If I can find the place in the programming  I'll post again or PM  you..

RTS

Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On 1/19/2017 4:14 PM, R T S wrote:
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Les,  look in the manual  to programming section   page  84
look at section  3.5.5.3.3  Central Station
1=Reporting   (YES)  "means the DACT is active"
2=Report Style   (backup only)  or  (First Available)   "if it says  
(Both) that's your problem.."

In addition  you may want to check primary and secondary number  
programming  just to be safe..

make sure one number is listed as primary and the other number  is  
secondary (ie..backup)
(if both are listed as primary, that can cause the double report also)

It looks complicated at first
but if you do a few of them,  it can get real simple..

best of luck...
--  
RTS

Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On 1/19/2017 6:04 PM, R T S wrote:
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RTS

Please check your email.

Thanks,

Les

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Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On Thursday, January 19, 2017 at 11:37:16 AM UTC-5, ABLE1 wrote:
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Thats one of the new Ul mandates each line tests   should be alternate every other day thou

Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On 1/20/2017 10:39 PM, NickMark wrote:
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Hi Nick,

It is a UL issue??  I had not heard about it.
When did that change??    Are other mfg's doing the same that you know??

If that is what is going on then it now makes sense what Tech Support said
in that it can't be programmed different.

Now I need to look up the UL words to understand better.

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little tidbit and can't find it.  Very challenging to find a good reference.

This is Honeywell's assessment of UL864 9th Edition.  I can only find a  
reference
to the requirement of having 2 means of communication.

http://honeywellfire.com/ul9/materials/ul864_9th_edition_web_presentation.pdf

Nick, any chance you know the UL Listing number or does anyone??
I would really like to read the words to better understand what I am  
dealing with.

Thanks,

Les

Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??

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I don't know when the requirement for testing alternate lines came in or ifs  
a UL requirement, but its in the NFPA 72 1999 edition.

It remained unchanged I believe through the 2010 edition of NFPA 72, but the  
2013 edition of NFPA 72 made some changes

NFPA 27 2010 allows 2 telephone lines to be used with a 24 hour test on  
alternating lines

NFPA 72 2010  26.6.3.2.1.5 (6)
exception No2:
Where two telephone lines (numbers) are used, it shall be permitted to test  
each telephone line (number) at alternating 24-hour intervals

NFPA 72 2013 I believe only allows a second telephone line as transmission  
means if an alternate method of transmission is not available and further  
states that if 2 telephone lines are used then the interval of the timer  
test is 6 hours which I believe can alternate between the two lines.

I'm not sure why MS5UD tests both lines at 24 hour intervals, perhaps the  
DACT is based on older technology designed before the requirement for  
testing alternate lines came into force and it was easier to make it test  
both lines rather than alternate lines, having said that it seems unlikely  
since the alternate line requirement has been around for some 15 years.

Can you set different test times for the 2 lines, if so I would set them 12  
hours apart and change the interval at the CS to 12 hours otherwise if they  
send the test signal at the same time the CS wouldn't flag it if only one  
test signal was received within the 24 hour period which seems to not comply  
with the alternate line testing which is designed to help ensure that both  
lines are working.

Doug





Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On 1/21/2017 11:38 AM, doug wrote:
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Thanks Doug,

Yes the alternate testing makes sense.  Test line 1 on Monday and line 2  
on Tuesday
the back to line 1 on Wednesday, etc., etc.

However I am getting two per day.  As per RTS suggestion I changed the  
test time
to 2:30am and 3:30am to see what happens.  I originally had the times  
about 12 hours
apart.  And it does test at the new times.(as it is programmed)

I did not grill the Tech Support guy too much other than to say that I  
doubt I
will ever install another Fire Lite panel.  Presently I am getting billed
by the C/S for double 24 hour test.  I just can't find a way around it.

As I understand the NFPA 72 2013 made changes to allow for a sole path  
as opposed to
two communication paths.  This was to allow for Cellular to function  
with a 6 minute
ping of the module I believe, but still does one 24 hour test.

BTW this MS5UD is new as of a couple of 2014.  I have just now made some  
time to
investigate the issue.

I am still mystified on this as it relates to Fire Lite and whatever  
code compliance they are
trying to spec.

Thanks for the input.

Les










Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??

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Does it also send the alarm reports on both lines?
The "Report Style" option gives 3 choices for each of the lines
Back up only
Both
First available.
If  they are set for "Both" and if the timer tests follow this option then  
changing to "Back up only" or "First available" may resolve the issue, but  
then it wouldn't comply with the alternate day requirement.

I think I would just set them 12 hours apart and not worry about it.

Doug  



Re: Fire Lite MS5UD??
On 1/22/2017 9:42 PM, doug wrote:
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Hi Doug,

I have only set for Back Up and First Available never for both.
The trouble with the 12 hour apart plan is that it will only help
for the first day.

3 am and 3 pm.  First day ok.  Second day and beyond will have two per day.

Based on other input I am thinking that Fire Lite has designed the panel
to conform with NFPA-72 2013 where each path of communication must be tested
on a 24 hour cycle.  Actually from what I have read it is to be a 6 hour  
test.
That is really going to bust the budget.
Anyhow as I am starting to understand Fire Lite has not giving the ability
to change this procedure.  Even though I live in a state that only accepts
NFPA 72 2007.

Unless I hear otherwise I may be fighting a losing battle.  More if I hear.

Have a good week!!

Les




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