Frank, if all you can do is flail with completely irrelevant arguments then perhaps you should just hang it up.
Frank, if all you can do is flail with completely irrelevant arguments then perhaps you should just hang it up.
That and their relationship with installing dealers. That has nothing to do with liability or security -- just profits.
They're free to do so all they like. Just don't pretend it has anything to do with prtoecting clients' security or terrorism.
I don't recall asking anyone to do that. However, companies like mine do give manufacturers and distributors something in return -- increased sales.
I usually don't need the keybuss protocol but I offer my purchase orders in return for what I do require. That usually works well enough.
I believe in encouraging my suppliers to do whatever makes it easier for my customers to use that product. One of the most frequent requests is for the manuals. I provide those with the product. If the manual is available online I share it with those who have a legitimate need for it -- clients, prospective clients, friendly competitors, etc.
Someone else put it that way, but I agree.
Security at Fort Knox is primarily provided by heavily fortified walls and a contingent of well-armed guards. The electronic security uses industry standard equipment and techniques. The work was done in compliance with pulished mil-specs and established standards. If you want to devote the time to it, you can learn who the service providers are, what equipment was installed and how.
The primary reason Fort Knox is so secure is twofold. Most people believe it's impenitrable so almost no one tries to break in. The other is that the multi-layered systems (CCTV, live guards, various types of intrusion and perimeter sensors) are strong enough to detect or stop even someone who knows the system. If not, we would have had to treat the installers the way the Egyptians did upon completion of the pyramids. Most modern technicians would object to contracts which call for their entombment. :^)
There's a huge difference between free and open discussion of security system protocols and revealing the mens to gain entry to any particular home.
Hollywood spies and crooked politicians worry about "need to know". In this forum we discuss means of improving security and HA systems. Anyone with an interest in the subject has sufficient need to know.
Umm, because no one would want their friends to know that they have anything to do with the guy? :^)
Nope. That name is trade marked by a bus company in NJ.
Sure thing. If Joe Websurfer wants to install an HA or alarm system at the Websurfer residence he needs to understand how the system works. Likewise, if the Websurfer family is fed up with poor service and slow response to alarms from Brick & Mortar Alarms, LLC, he is entitled to know how to service his own system.
It's not a blanket indictment. It's simply a fact that obscurity is a myth. You cannot possibly keep panel design a secret no matter what you do. That means that obscurity cannot be maintained. Furthermore, there are lots of people other than alarm installers with a legitimate need to understand their own security systems.
No one is asking for *all* the details. Most DIY clients only want to know how to program the system.
I do... daily.
Feel free to continue. Meanwhile, I'll keep sharing what I can about alarm and HA system design with anyone who wants to learn.
Wrong. Casinos routinely invite TV camera crews and reporters in to view and broadcast to the public the innards of their anti-cheating and anti-crime systems, including video cameras catching employees and customers trying to beat the system. By doing so they create an image of practically unbeatable security which significantly reduces the number of people who are willing to try to cheat.
Nope. We just prefer to focus on things that matter to HA and security alarms. Crazies flying airplanes into the World Trade Center have nothing to do with your home alarm system.[Gentle Readers: What follows is completely OT but what the heck...]
... while collecting tens of thousands of pages on such "terrorist" organizations as the ACLU. Don't for one minute believe that the present administration gives a rat's jiminex about national security. Their *only* concern is consolidation of their own grip on power and the financial windfall they and their friends have gained because of 9/11.
Heh, heh, heh... :^)
Makes it easier for them to steal $billions from the public?
"20 times"?? Another misleading comment. I haven't flamed you once. I pull your chain about as much as anyone elses, and that's all done in good fun.
Really?? I do my own brake jobs. A couple of crescent wrenches, a one-way bleeder and small bucket is about all you require... Oh... there's a degree of "elbow grease" needed as well, and a couple of good solid jack stands.
You've missed the point... again...
What a load of cod's whollop. Oh... I forgot... You're not a Dealer, are you?? Had to abandon your monitoring clients because the Florida Attorney General's office investigated your operation and made a few "suggestions", right??
In your mind, perhaps...
Uh-huh... Name one (that's UL or ULC listed).
Seems to me that a "profit margin" on an item that exceeds 1000% must have been pretty tough to let go. After all, AC did offer free monitoring to their Dealers that sold a particular package, didn't they?? As for their being UL Listed... I'd suggest you do a little further investigation. Seems to me that a company interested in providing service to independent Dealers would ensure their UL Listing information appears somewhere on their website...
Let's not. I'd like the people here to see what you consider to be "unprovoked flames":
"You get a lot of flak because you frequently post lies, innuendo, and misleading statements and for no other reason. You don't "advocate" for anyone but yourself and continue to flog product in ASA against the Group's FAQ. People "tolerate" your doing that here because you're "helpful", but in ASA you contribute absolutely nothing that isn't laced with some form of personal attack or invective.
You still haven't answered Mark's question about which "distributor" I work for and you can't because (once again) you don't really know and you've been caught telling another lie about someone. Tsk!!!"
Show me where any of the above isn't true. Post the name of the distributor you say I work for, Robert.
As for your earlier comment on about my not being an an Elk Dealer... I have told you on several occasions that trying to find things out about me in particular only serves to highlight your rather miserable investigative skills... But do please keep trying... I find your frequent efforts at discrediting me actually quite amusing...
You're lying... again.
Alarm Central has been monitoring DIY installations for years and you know it. NextAlarm offers UL listed monitoring direct to the public, especially to DIYers. There are others I've contacted from time to time but I don't keep a list.
That would be pretty good if it actually existed outside your mind.
I think they still do. The first year was (is?) free to the dealer if the dealer sells one of several packages from certain distributors. I passed most of that on to my clients by reducing the first year's monitoring fee from $151 to $100 if they ordered the service with the system.
You might like to think so but their UL listing is available on UL's website. That is sufficient.
Naah. Let's. You only post in this newsgroup to pester me. You've no other interest here. Everyone knows it. You've been repeatedly asked by numerous other folks to go away because you contribute virtually nothing but flames. I'll add my voice to the chorus. Go away, Olson.
Nowhere near as frequent as your own efforts to discredit yourself. Hang it up Frank, you're nowhere near credible anymore.
Oh?? I suppose the recent investigation you went through had absolutely*nothing* to do with the fact that you've stopped actively selling and collecting money for providing a monitoring service.
Nope. They don't deal with end users direct. You must purchase their service through a Dealer.
NextAlarm is a Dealer. They outsource their monitoring to "several UL Listed stations around the country." Read their FAQ. In fact they even sell a security package that includes a wireless intrusion system.
Uh-huh... and you frequently "lose" business cards too... You frequently use innuendo, misleading statments and lies to bolster your rather fragile ego and flame individuals that don't agree with (or object to) your "agenda". When you get caught you ignore comments from the individual that catches you... Where do I work again?? What's the name of my company??
Uh-huh.... When you obtain a service for FREE and charge the customer $100.00, what's the markup??
So what's the markup from "FREE" to $100.00?? And what's the "deal" with the use of the word "dealer"?? I thought you just said they offered monitoring to DIY's... You keep "dancing" in one spot like you do and you'll wear out the carpet.
Heh... If UL is like any other large organization, the "listing" there doesn't mean much (their webmaster may have not gotten around to removing them). Why not ask them (AC) why they killed the page on their website that*said* they were UL Listed for fire??
Nope. I only "pester" you when you lie.
Aux contraire. I have several.
Dream on, Robert.
Uh-huh... sure... There are several individuals here that Robert has frequent clashes with. They all start with something Robert says first (whether it's in this group or another). I'm sure that when he finally leaves for Brazil, you won't see these kinds of responses for at least the three months that he's gone. Robert has called me a liar. I invite him to prove that or shut up.
No problemo. You'll notice that Bass *still* hasn't posted where I work. He "says" I work as a "counter clerk" for a "small distributor in Vancouver". I've asked (as have others in ASA) what the name of that "distributor" is, but every time we do, he goes "silent". If this isn't proof enough for you then I'm not certain what "standard" applies here. He's a self-serving, ego-centric, lying bastard (and that's *not* a flame!!). It's amazing to me that you tolerate his attitude based on a few "helpful" posts (that always include some reference to his website). You seem to think I have a "personal vendetta" against this man. I don't. He doesn't even know who I am or where I work for pete's sake!! He hasn't harmed me either personally or professionally. He has lied about me, used innuendo, and posted some rather vile and depraved remarks about me that no one in their right mind would tolerate. Yet you have the temerity to suggest that *I* have no credibility!!
He's completely wrong with respect to the Elk M1XEP module (but won't admit to it). Oh... and anyone can become a Dealer for Elk as long as they register an initial panel (provide them with a serial number) and submit relevant contact information (you have to be an alarm company or a company involved in the low voltage side of the electrical business).
I have no wish to foster any emnity in this Newsgroup. I am interested in HA and have learned a lot about Russound and other such products here. I will continue to offer advice with respect to security related queries and issues (it is, after all, my area of expertise). I will try to avoid posting comments about Robert, though. I have no wish to create any problems here. I will *not* however ignore libellous or unsubstantiated comments about me from this man. If Robert wishes to avoid dragging this group "down", then he will also make the effort to avoid making posts he knows I will have no choice but to respond.
By the way, the Elk M-1 Gold will *not* transmit ASCII strings over the M1XEP. You cannot "instruct" the panel to do so either. There is *no* provision for doing so in programming and certainly none in the software. This may be something the Elk Engineers may consider adding in the future, but the present firmware does not allow (or make provision for) it.
WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP!
No one who has watched your postings can believe you typed that with a straight face.
You came here as with a vendetta against Robert because of what you and the jerks in ASA perceive to be an insult by him (giving homeowners the ability to configure their system when their "professional" installer wouldn't"
You have continually called him names and hurled insults at him, in many threads that had NOTHING to do with you or any "errors" that you think he made.
If you actually would post a quarter the number of useful comments as you currently post insults, people might start to respect anything you say.
giving homeowners the ability
now that's a load of crap! I don't care what he gives homeowners. I do care that he is a troublemaker and a jerk and a liar and attacked me the first time I asked a question years ago an usenet.
Are you FRANK OLS> I have no wish to foster any emnity in this Newsgroup. I am interested in
I know you CHA guys are thick but no I am not Frank, I am Joe. I am not 'from' ASA, I am in usenet. As for credibility, I am just posting my observation. Don't like it that you can't control usenet, huh? Well like bAss has said many times, paraphrasing here.......I am going to post what I want when I want and you or nobody else can stop me.
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