5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p

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I have a Vista 20p panel with 2 6160v keypads and recently added a 5881ENH  
receiver so I could add key fobs.  I successfully programmed the system to  
enroll 2 5834-4 key fobs in high-security mode.  I did program them to asso
ciate each with a user and did a go/no test to ensure they are enrolled and
 working.

Here is my question/issue: randomly the key fobs stop working temporarily.  
 And it?s not always the same key fob that stops responding.  Somet
imes they both work, sometimes only one, sometimes only the other, sometime
s neither.  And without any specific action on my part, they may start work
ing again.

The 5881 is mounted in the closet next to the Vista panel.  It's about 45 f
eet max away from the front door.

I don?t know enough about how the communication works, but is it po
ssible for it to temporarily get out of sync?   How do I figure out the iss
ue so it becomes totally reliable?

Thank you!

Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
On 11/1/2018 6:11 PM, Roger Horwitz wrote:
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By chance are the key fobs going out of range and losing sync with the  
receiver?

--  

*Rocky T. Squirrel, esq.*


Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 4:19:51 PM UTC-7, RTS wrote:
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ENH receiver so I could add key fobs.  I successfully programmed the system
 to enroll 2 5834-4 key fobs in high-security mode.  I did program them to  
associate each with a user and did a go/no test to ensure they are enrolled
 and working.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
ly.  And it?s not always the same key fob that stops responding.  S
ometimes they both work, sometimes only one, sometimes only the other, some
times neither.  And without any specific action on my part, they may start  
working again.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
45 feet max away from the front door.
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t possible for it to temporarily get out of sync?   How do I figure out the
 issue so it becomes totally reliable?
Quoted text here. Click to load it

Well, they are on our car keychains so they do go out of range when we leav
e. But when they are used to arm/disarm they are within 40 feet. The red li
ght on the fob blinks several times when I hold down one of the buttons for
 at least 3 seconds.

Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
Well, by the description in your above story, you appear to be a homeowner  
or a not very experienced technician since you "successfully" programmed th
e remotes.  

All that aside, you also mention that the unit is in the closet next to the
 panel box. You failed to mention if the house is multi-story, or if this c
loset is in the basement, or that perhaps there is structural materials tha
t could be interfering with the transmission of the fobs, like a refrigerat
or, water heater, concrete or the like. Those fobs you bought, do not have  
the power of a microwave.

There is not enough information available to come to any conclusion to your
 dilemma.

The ideal location for the receiver is the highest spot in your house, away
 from any steel, aluminum, or any material dense in its atomic structure- f
obs will not work in an X-ray room since it is shielded with lead. If you d
o not have any available location near the panel box that is free of "inter
ference materials", then perhaps find a location close to any of your keypa
ds, to install the receiver. The receiver uses the key-bus wiring anyway an
d that is what keypad wiring uses. Perhaps you have a keypad that is on a w
all adjacent to a closet where you could relocate the receiver. It is not r
ocket science, fobs just need no interference with other conflicting wirele
ss, and they don't work thru dense materials like steel, lead, aluminum, et
c.

I have used a lot of wireless from different manufacturers, and it is rare  
for Honeywell keyfobs to not work properly.... except in the case of wirele
ss interference--in that aspect they do come to the top.

Since you took the long and expensive route to keyfobs, you should investig
ate using the after-market fobs that work on many different systems- those  
should have topped out at less that $50 for the receiver and 2 fobs... and  
they also comes with a button on the remotes that activates a small light b
eam... way ahead of Honeywell.

The light blinking on the fobs is there only to tell you that it sent 'the  
"WIRELESS BEAM" out into the wonderful expanse of the ether. It does not me
an that it communicated with the receiver.

If you can stand by the receiver and use the remotes, and the system consis
tently arms and disarms, then it is either interference by dense materials  
or interference from other wireless sources.

It is best to hold the remote firmly with the left hand, and using the fing
er of the right hand to activate the remote. Make sure that you stand flat-
footed first. Soothing music in the background is also encouraged... no har
d-rock.

...A little laughter helps on any day.

Hogan

Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
On Saturday, November 3, 2018 at 9:30:36 PM UTC-7, HOGAN wrote:
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r or a not very experienced technician since you "successfully" programmed  
the remotes.  
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he panel box. You failed to mention if the house is multi-story, or if this
 closet is in the basement, or that perhaps there is structural materials t
hat could be interfering with the transmission of the fobs, like a refriger
ator, water heater, concrete or the like. Those fobs you bought, do not hav
e the power of a microwave.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
ur dilemma.
ay from any steel, aluminum, or any material dense in its atomic structure-
 fobs will not work in an X-ray room since it is shielded with lead. If you
 do not have any available location near the panel box that is free of "int
erference materials", then perhaps find a location close to any of your key
pads, to install the receiver. The receiver uses the key-bus wiring anyway  
and that is what keypad wiring uses. Perhaps you have a keypad that is on a
 wall adjacent to a closet where you could relocate the receiver. It is not
 rocket science, fobs just need no interference with other conflicting wire
less, and they don't work thru dense materials like steel, lead, aluminum,  
etc.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
e for Honeywell keyfobs to not work properly.... except in the case of wire
less interference--in that aspect they do come to the top.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
igate using the after-market fobs that work on many different systems- thos
e should have topped out at less that $50 for the receiver and 2 fobs... an
d they also comes with a button on the remotes that activates a small light
 beam... way ahead of Honeywell.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
e "WIRELESS BEAM" out into the wonderful expanse of the ether. It does not  
mean that it communicated with the receiver.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
istently arms and disarms, then it is either interference by dense material
s or interference from other wireless sources.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
nger of the right hand to activate the remote. Make sure that you stand fla
t-footed first. Soothing music in the background is also encouraged... no h
ard-rock.
Quoted text here. Click to load it

Hogan, thank you for your insightful albeit condescending response.  I?
??m glad I was able to brighten your day with my post.  I?ll gi
ve your advice to move the wireless receiver a try.

FWIW, the reason I posted this asking for assistance is that the behavior d
oesn?t make sense.  On any given day at any given time, I can be st
anding with a fob in each hand and one might work while the other won?
?t.  Wouldn?t interference affect BOTH the same?  

If you?re going to post a response, would you mind doing so with a  
bit less sarcasm, maybe just answering the question or ask for more informa
tion in a civil way?  Yes, I?m a tech savvy homeowner.  No need to  
put me down for that.  

Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
On 11/4/2018 2:05 PM, Roger Horwitz wrote:
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Roger Roger Roger
Please be advised that this is a usenet newsgroup.
Where nobody should be thin skinned when posting here.

As for your challenge think about this.
Everything man made has a + or - tolerance.

If I told you or typed about all of the freaky unexplained
things that I have noticed you would be reading
for a very long time.  Not going to take the time here
but suffice it to say that some things can't be explained.
Or better said, it is not worth the time and aggravation
to figure it out.  Choose a different solution and move on.

When I have a freaky happening with a product and I am at my
wits end I call Tech Support.  The number of times I have been told
"Never heard of that before" is staggering.

The best thing would be to follow basic guidelines that were
very well explained by Hogan and see what happens.

So look for patterns.  My trouble shooting rule is to find the nots.
Once you find all the "it's not this and not that" then the only
thing left is what it is.

If you have all the "tech savvy" stuff you say you have, then
you should figure out what might be going on, or not.
Maybe you have a bad or sometimes defective thingie.

Isn't getting free education wonderful??

Good Luck!!

Les

Hey Hogan,
BTW excellent post, very informative and to the point.
Especially!!
"Soothing music in the background is also encouraged... no hard-rock"






Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
On Sunday, November 4, 2018 at 2:05:37 PM UTC-5, Roger Horwitz wrote:
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ner or a not very experienced technician since you "successfully" programme
d the remotes.  
Quoted text here. Click to load it
 the panel box. You failed to mention if the house is multi-story, or if th
is closet is in the basement, or that perhaps there is structural materials
 that could be interfering with the transmission of the fobs, like a refrig
erator, water heater, concrete or the like. Those fobs you bought, do not h
ave the power of a microwave.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
your dilemma.
away from any steel, aluminum, or any material dense in its atomic structur
e- fobs will not work in an X-ray room since it is shielded with lead. If y
ou do not have any available location near the panel box that is free of "i
nterference materials", then perhaps find a location close to any of your k
eypads, to install the receiver. The receiver uses the key-bus wiring anywa
y and that is what keypad wiring uses. Perhaps you have a keypad that is on
 a wall adjacent to a closet where you could relocate the receiver. It is n
ot rocket science, fobs just need no interference with other conflicting wi
reless, and they don't work thru dense materials like steel, lead, aluminum
, etc.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
are for Honeywell keyfobs to not work properly.... except in the case of wi
reless interference--in that aspect they do come to the top.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
stigate using the after-market fobs that work on many different systems- th
ose should have topped out at less that $50 for the receiver and 2 fobs...  
and they also comes with a button on the remotes that activates a small lig
ht beam... way ahead of Honeywell.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
the "WIRELESS BEAM" out into the wonderful expanse of the ether. It does no
t mean that it communicated with the receiver.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
nsistently arms and disarms, then it is either interference by dense materi
als or interference from other wireless sources.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
finger of the right hand to activate the remote. Make sure that you stand f
lat-footed first. Soothing music in the background is also encouraged... no
 hard-rock.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
??m glad I was able to brighten your day with my post.  I?ll gi
ve your advice to move the wireless receiver a try.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
 doesn?t make sense.  On any given day at any given time, I can be  
standing with a fob in each hand and one might work while the other won?
??t.  Wouldn?t interference affect BOTH the same?  
Quoted text here. Click to load it
a bit less sarcasm, maybe just answering the question or ask for more infor
mation in a civil way?  Yes, I?m a tech savvy homeowner.  No need t
o put me down for that.

Most of what Mr Hogan says is accurate.  

If you can stand near the receiver and the remotes work every time and when
 you move away, they don't ??.. then the problem can be cau
sed by any number of circumstances. Interference. Although,  you didn't say
 if your alarm system was a wireless or hardwired system. If your alarm sys
tem is a wireless system and you are not experiencing any problems it's not
 likely and interference problem. More likely it is some sort of signal blo
ckage. Moving the receiver to a new location could conceivably help. You'll
 have to experiment. Connect a long wire between the panel and the receiver
 and walk around and try placing it at other locations in the house that yo
u can get a wire from the receiver to either the panel or a keypad.  

If this has never worked then another possibility is simply that you have a
 defective receiver.  

Due to wave length considerations which frequency bands being used, sometim
es just moving the receiver a couple of feet can cure a problem. You have n
o idea what wave patterns are being set up in your home due to metal object
s. Radio waves are bouncing off of  and being impeded by every object in yo
ur home. Beat frequencies, oscillations and clashing with other wireless de
vices in your home can create havoc  

Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
On Sunday, November 4, 2018 at 1:05:37 PM UTC-6, Roger Horwitz wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it
ner or a not very experienced technician since you "successfully" programme
d the remotes.  
Quoted text here. Click to load it
 the panel box. You failed to mention if the house is multi-story, or if th
is closet is in the basement, or that perhaps there is structural materials
 that could be interfering with the transmission of the fobs, like a refrig
erator, water heater, concrete or the like. Those fobs you bought, do not h
ave the power of a microwave.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
your dilemma.
away from any steel, aluminum, or any material dense in its atomic structur
e- fobs will not work in an X-ray room since it is shielded with lead. If y
ou do not have any available location near the panel box that is free of "i
nterference materials", then perhaps find a location close to any of your k
eypads, to install the receiver. The receiver uses the key-bus wiring anywa
y and that is what keypad wiring uses. Perhaps you have a keypad that is on
 a wall adjacent to a closet where you could relocate the receiver. It is n
ot rocket science, fobs just need no interference with other conflicting wi
reless, and they don't work thru dense materials like steel, lead, aluminum
, etc.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
are for Honeywell keyfobs to not work properly.... except in the case of wi
reless interference--in that aspect they do come to the top.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
stigate using the after-market fobs that work on many different systems- th
ose should have topped out at less that $50 for the receiver and 2 fobs...  
and they also comes with a button on the remotes that activates a small lig
ht beam... way ahead of Honeywell.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
the "WIRELESS BEAM" out into the wonderful expanse of the ether. It does no
t mean that it communicated with the receiver.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
nsistently arms and disarms, then it is either interference by dense materi
als or interference from other wireless sources.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
finger of the right hand to activate the remote. Make sure that you stand f
lat-footed first. Soothing music in the background is also encouraged... no
 hard-rock.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
??m glad I was able to brighten your day with my post.  I?ll gi
ve your advice to move the wireless receiver a try.
Quoted text here. Click to load it
 doesn?t make sense.  On any given day at any given time, I can be  
standing with a fob in each hand and one might work while the other won?
??t.  Wouldn?t interference affect BOTH the same?  
Quoted text here. Click to load it
a bit less sarcasm, maybe just answering the question or ask for more infor
mation in a civil way?  Yes, I?m a tech savvy homeowner.  No need t
o put me down for that.

I might suggest you message another member of this forum instead, his name  
is Robert Bass and I'm sure he will be able to help you

Re: 5834-4 key fobs intermittently stop working with 5881-ENH receiver connected to Vista 20p
1ST TO DO.  

"If you can stand by the receiver and use the remotes, and the system consistently arms and disarms, then it is either interference by dense materials or interference from other wireless sources."


2ND TO DO.

Turn off/unplug all wireless devices in the house, including but not limited to, garage door openers, anything wifi enabled or containing wifi transmitter/receiver, non-analog TV antennas can cause interference, especially if amplified.  

3RD TO DO.

If location is not appropriate because of materials, move receiver.

4TH. If all else fails, call a local alarm company that uses your type of system day in & day out. They may be able to narrow it down faster since they will be in your house.

Someone else in this group may have a different answer.




  

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