NEWS: Mobile websites fail to satisfy users

Simple answer. Get an iPhone with the real Internet.

Yes, I think Apple has thrown a wrench in the works for all the talk of having more mobile-friendly websites. Mobile sites are still clunky to navigate-even the better ones.

Kurt hath wroth:

(trimmed...)

I have a Verizon XV6700 running Windoze Mobile 5. The screen is small (320x240 QVGA), but still very useful. With some effort, I can navigate the larger web pages. List of WM5 friendly sites:

There are also some starts at iPhone friendly web sites:

I expect the list to grow as irate iPhone owners complain about difficulties navigating overly complex web pages.

This should be of help for iPhone web site designers. It's an iPhone

320x480 screen simulator for Safari.

eBay is a bit of a challenge but there are 3rd party vendors with solutions:

The major problem for WM5 is the lack of Java. It's also a problem on the iPhone. It's there, but not enabled:

Probably has bugs and they need time to work them out. Or, they didn't bother to pay Sun the license fee. Dunno.

I think I figured out what most iPhone owners all have in common.... A general lack of patience.

Hope it didn't turn out like this:

Or we just turn it sideways!

Seriously, I've been surprised at the "full Web" experience the iPhone gives me. Never once had that feeling on any of the WinCE/Winmob or Palm devices (or any PDA or phone for that matter--heck I'll even throw "Smart" Display in there too).

Thanks for the link.

Yep. Having the page scale to the screen size is a feature I don't have on my xv6700. However, I can zoom in and out. Can you read the CNN text on your iPhone or do you have to zoom in and out?

I just loaded CNN.com on my xv6700. Everything fits nicely as it automagically rearranged the page to be narrow but very long. There's no horizontal scroll bar showing, but the vertical is many pages long. Good enough for me.

Also, try:

I also can do that on my XV6700. It helps with some web pages but isn't a total solution. I rarely use the keyboard or turn the screen sideways. Incidentally, my XV6700 has a touch sensitive screen. I don't use that either because my fat fingers often hit the wrong "button". Or, maybe I need target practice.

I'm curious. Can you run the iPhone with one hand?

The iPhone is impressive from what I've seen (but haven't tried yet). Whether it's worth $500 and having to deal with the new Ma Bell is an open question. I have another year to go on my Verizon contract, so I'll probably just wait and see what happens.

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 13:48:29 -0700, "Tinman" wrote in :

Opera Mini J2ME and the Opera Mini embedded in my RAZR V3xx do a great job of rendering most regular website.

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:46:29 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote in :

eBay has a very good WAP interface that works on most cell phones.

That is indeed a major problem.

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:24:10 -0700, Kurt wrote in :

Opera Mini J2ME and the Opera Mini embedded in my RAZR V3xx do a great job of rendering most regular website.

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 13:12:00 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@sbcglobal.net wrote in :

No thanks. My RAZR V3xx blows it away.

Generally have to zoom in order to read detail text. But zooming is pretty much instantaneous, and having that full page view for some reason makes it seem as if you are browsing regular Web pages. It's also intelligent in that it will zoom to fit text width when you double tap, pop up a balloon with the URL if you press-and-hold on a link, etc.

Yes I could do that with my Treo too. On the Treo (Blazer) that was called "optimized mode." But it changed the format of Web pages, and was sometimes confusing. I turned it off to compare, as best as possible (as you can see cnn.com didn't turn out too well) how the two compared without trying to reformat the page.

Neither did I much back in my PPC days. But the iPhone is really different (can't believe I keep writing that). I often use it landscape mode as it's practically second nature now. Keep in mind you just turn the thing sideways and, presto, you have more horizontal space. And for some reason Apple has seemingly wrung every last sub-pixel out of the display. It almost seems more like 640 x 480.

Without a doubt it seems sharper than my Treo's 320 x 320, and it should be less so since it's actually physically larger (taking into consideration the extra 160 pixels in height, naturally). It's brighter yet has deeper blacks, has more contrast, has more vibrant colors and color saturation, and is at least 3x more visible in Arizona sunlight than my Treo's display. And I

*like* the Treo's display.

Incidentally, my XV6700 has a touch sensitive screen. I

I had that happen often with my Treo, usually when I wanted to do something quick and didn't want to pull out the stylus.

To a certain degree yes--I've even got a technique for holding it in landscape orientation when browsing the Web. I can hold it sideways and still use my thumb for navigation. Ain't perfect but it ain't two hands either.

The screen is also designed to be used entirely with fingers--you can't use a stylus (I still sometimes reach for a stylus!). It's actually not that hard to get used to, and there are lots of "little things" that sort of all come together to make the whole thing easier to use.

Braille does an excellent job of rendering most text. So what?

"Most"- LOL. On a pitiful tiny screen, most look terrible. Opera on my Treo (same imaging as yours) looks horrific. Real web has it all beat.

Yes, I use the eBay mobile link for my Treo. Terrible. Scroling and redrawing until the cows come home. Why compromise when you can have the real web?

Java as in Javascript, or Java as in J2ME? If the former, 3rd-party browsers like Opera Mobile or Netfront address that; if the latter, most WM5 phones include a JVM, although carriers occasionally remove it from their branded versions (like T-Mobile did to my MDA.) An "unbranded" ROM fixed that for me, but more conservative owners can download one without reflashing if need be. I personally still haven't found a J2ME app to run that is preverable to a WM-native app with the same functionality, however- i.e. the WM-native version of Google Maps beats the Java version (although both pale to Windows Live Search 2.0, which now includes one-touch rerouting if you wander off-course.)

"Tinman" hath wroth:

Thanks. That's what's lacking on my XV6700 PDAphone. I can tediously change type size and some limited zooming, but nothing as fast or intuitive as what's on the iPhone.

I did some screen grabs of CNN on my XV6700:

CNN does it quite nicely. It reformats to fit the screen. For example, there was a list of videos with thumbnails that appeared in one long column in the portrait mode, but showed up two across in the landscape mode.

Ok. You've used the XV6700. It's the same as the Sprint PPC-6700. However, if you didn't do the firmware update from the UTC Starcom web pile, you probably had some problems.

I can see why. Apple may have made a big mistake with all the hype. They've attacted the expected attention, but they've also triggered my defense mechanism against such hype. I often find it difficult to believe the hype and am disappointed by the product. That's my current reaction to the iPhone. It just can't be that good.

Well, the larger screen is a huge plus. For one thing, you can do more with it. In my case, my eyes have been slowing going downhill. Many years ago, my home computah was a Sanyo MBC-775 with a 5" diagonal screen.

I'm in the process of purging the house and I found this thing. Of course, I had to try it. HD was dead, but the screen lit up. CGA color (320x200) in 16 colors. I couldn't read it, even with reading glasses. Small cell displays are for youngsters.

Thanks. That's a basic requirement for my derranged method of operation. That's also what's really wrong with the stylus... It requires both hands.

I've gotten fairly good at using MS WM5 Voice Command:

to reduce the amount of stylus poking. However, I spent far too much time organizing a command list and building macros.

Sounds good. However, I'll wait and see. What I have is (mostly) adequate for the purpose. I have a year left on my contract. Lots of things can change in a year, along with the predicted iPhone clones.

Yep, that doesn't look too bad really. Pretty much like my Treo in optimized mode:

Keep in mind I would rarely try to load that page on my Treo 650 (CDMA 1x) as it takes about 5 minutes to complete--and gawd forbid I try to actually tap into an article. iPhone was about 1.5 minutes on EDGE and 15 seconds on WiFi.

mobil phone sites are suppose to be for quick easy access. More sites are being developed each day with different URL, the phone usually will re-direct to the mobile site based on the equipment. If you want full internet access buy a data card and carry your laptop. Not everyone needs that much capability!

On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 00:47:38 -0600, Todd Allcock wrote in :

Cute, but it leaves out average folks. ;)

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 19:10:09 -0700, Kurt wrote in :

It actually works quite well.