new z-wave gateway

Jan 13, 2008 24 Replies

Which is exactly what X-10 was for quite a while.

Please, give it a rest. X-10's tremendously bad track record for reliability does not make it a viable solution any longer.

One product does not solve a legion of ills. It's a fine product, from a small supplier, but it's a band-aid, at best.

X-10 RF != X-10 powerline. You conflate to entirely different technologies.

But it's not now, and that makes it available to a wide range of manufacturers, allowing users to second-source products. That means they won't be stuck with a house filled with products of a bankrupt manufacturer. IMHO, that's quite a comfort. Free and open competition inspires better design, and an open standard only enhances that competition.

As I've said, your experience appears to be with the old, unboosted X-10. I've readily acknowledged that, and I've specifically avoided slamming you for writing about products that you appear to have little or no current experience with, namely the XTB and the V572 "enhancers." But there comes a point where not having any direct experience with what you are making claims about comes to work against you and your overall credibility. To that end, I think it might be you who needs to "give it a rest" before you end up goring your own ox. (-:

Boosting the X-10 PLC signal and RF sensitivity redefines the X-10 standard. You don't have to believe me Bill, because I am clearly not the only one saying it. The XTB and the V572 have created quite a renaissance within the X-10 community because with them, centralized controller signals can now propagate reliably throughout the entire house via both RF and PLC.

No, it's most definitely not a band-aid, it's a cure. Boosting the X-10 signal turns out to solve most of that alleged "legion" of ills since most of the X-10 problems we see reported here concern signal strength issues. X-10 was fine for when it was designed, and now that there's a powerful repeater/amplifier like the XTB, it's fine for the current home electrical environment, even with all its CFLs and switch mode power supply warts.

technologies.

What??!!!! X-10 clearly operates via both PLC and RF with an incredible range of control options that dwarfs what all other "new" protocols offer, probably combined. IIRC, the RF controllers for X-10 first appeared over 20 years ago. You're reaching for straws here by complaining that the two quite different methods of control X-10 offers its end users is some sort of

*bad* thing. It's a good thing, and it gives the end user tremendous flexibility in tailoring a home automation solution. Adding the V572 to my system *vastly* improved the RF reception range and the system's usefulness and reliability. I like to be able to control the porchlights from a keyfob. How many new protocols even OFFER an RF keyfob?

I prefer the tremendous selection of "here and now" gear that the X-10 protocol offers. I'm especially fond of X-10's breadth of offerings when its compared to the "we'll have one of those any day" promises from the makers of UPB, Insteon and the like. The problem I see is that "any day" for some of these manufacturers is likely to be synonymous with "hopefully before we go bankrupt."

Ten years from now, UPB, Insteon and all the other new protocols may have vanished but I guarantee you that X-10 will still be performing quite nicely in 1,000's, and maybe even 10's or 100's of thousand homes. By that time, some smart manufacturer will have bought out Jeff's design so that it can be mass-produced at 1/4 the current price.

Sometimes, having the largest installed user base is all it takes to bury the competition. It's all about critical mass. That's a really important element in the current business environment where 5 or 6 new home automation protocols are trying to get a foothold in one of the worst housing markets we've seen since the 1980's when interest rates topped 18%. Someone's not going to make it, but I am sure that X-10 will. I suspect UPB will be the first to go, but only time will tell.

-- Bobby G.

Ford sells both cars and trucks, yet they're quite different. Likewise X-10's RF solution, weak as it is, shares little in common with it's powerline garbage, besides the company name.

The only thing that carries X-10 along is that it's cheap. It certainly doesn't work reliably. Good, fast, cheap, s*it X-10 can't even muster two of those points. It's no good and it's slow as hell. That it's cheap doesn't do much to redeem it.

It's you that's reaching for straws trying to prop up your misbegotten investment in X-10 trash. Please, spare us the delusions.

Bill, As a user of the XTB-II and XTB products in two homes, I can tell you that these products totally redifine the reliability issue with X10 PLC products. With an XTB-II or XTB installed (depending on application) you can achieve virtually flawless operation equivalent to UPB (which I tried but found it wasn't as robust as it claimed) or Insteon (which I also have and it works quite well). In fact, had the XTB-II been available before I bought into Insteon I would not have bothered with it. X10 is MUCH easier to manage than the newer protocols and there is a wide array of product choices available. I have no axe to grind here, I'm just reporting my experiences. I have every hope that new Insteon products - particularly controllers and software - will soon be available to give me the same capabilities I have with X10 but, until that time, X10 still rules.

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