CFL and 'X10 noise'

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I remember the older CFL's (circa 2001) used to either dump a ton of line noise or suck X10 signals, I hope the newer CFL's are better.

Check out these very short clips

I have been using CFLs for a year and a half now (mostly NVision brand) and have not noticed any degradation in my X10 performance/behavior. And believe me, if my wife had noticed I WOULD have heard all about it!

Jim

The nVision bulbs are unique in my experience for not giving X-10 fits. That's excluding some special very high-priced allegedly dimmable CFL's I got from Smarthome. I don't count them since I can't bring myself to pay $17 a light bulb anymore. Once as an experiment but not as a commodity.

I had tried a lot of bulbs and most had either noise or signal sucking issues. But Marc H. recommended nVision here and I have been able to abandon special X-10 filters in the places that I use them. I'm hoping he's right on the money again with the web control device that he recently described in another thread 'cuz I just ordered one. But I digress.

My experience in the past with CFL's dictated that I buy a LOT of the nVision once it was clear they worked so much better than the GE's I had been using and the Lites of Americas (which I've banned). Internal designs of electronic gear can vary greatly over a product's lifetime and I'd already been burned by "slip-streamed" changes. I had one batch of GE bulbs that were fine, but another batch of the exact same model made about a month later sucked the X-10 signal down about 1.5V. So I bought a carton of 4 packs of the 13W bulbs that were on sale for some ridiculously low price at Home Depot and they've been mostly doing quite nicely. Mostly. One minor problem is they are just not bright enough and like most CFLs, dim considerably after the first few months of use. As a result, I end up using Y splitters or two fixture where I would have used one before. Still 26W beats 60 or 75W of electricity. I also find that when you get to the CFL equivalent of 100W tungsten sizes, CFLs start to get awfully big and hard to accommodate in many fixtures..

The only serious problem left with the nVision bulbs (that the GE CFL's ironically did NOT suffer from) are that they flash after being remotely turned off. This is especially true of a single bulb controlled by a single switch or module. That combination apparently allows enough of the "local sense" current to charge up a cap in the CFL to a level where it can cause the bulb to glow, briefly. This cycle repeats forever unless local sense is disabled but I've had hit and miss results with the mods to disable that function. Disabling local sense, particularly for a table or floor lamp, is something I'd rather not do, anyway. Another way to get around the flashing is to use the bulbs in a multiple bulb fixture. In those cases, or in cases where there's some other load on the module, the CFL caps never seem to accumulate enough charge to flash.

Another thing I am grateful for is that the newer CFL's seem more immune from the leakage/charge/flash cycle being sensed as a "local turn on request" and the module kicking back ON right after it's been turned off. If there was ever an event with a low spousal approval factor, it's lights turning themselves back on all by themselves, every time you send an OFF command. Very bad. Basement shoplites had to be rewired as a result with at least two lites per module. Lost some "addressability" but gained lots and lots of SAF!

I'm hoping that once LED or hi-efficiency incandescent arrive, that the problems I'm having with CFLs will go away. I realize that LEDs will have some similar issues, being electrically quite different, at least in the "eyes" of the X-10 module circuits, from the tungsten bulbs they are replacing. However, accommodating CFL bulbs and X-10 forced serious circuit changes (pulling neutrals to switches or in one case, running two new outdoor circuits) that would serve LEDs well. The biggest issue is the difference in the way the X-10 "local sense" current leakage is handled by CFL and LED circuitry. I've been reading elsewhere that people with lighted wall switches, automatic light timers and anything else that draws power to operate from the light circuit is subject to trouble.

Someday, I'd like to be able to load a CFL or an LED lamp into the bedroom overhead fixture, the last place left were I haven't pulled a neutral and just have it work and not flash like a 70's disco ball.

-- Bobby G.

Lots of good info. Although I did end up with a few extras, I may have to (belatedly) stock up on the nVision bulbs just to head off the problems. But, hey, they are supposed to last 1000 years, right?

I get around the local sense problem by putting one incandescent bulb in multiple-bulb installations. Does sort of defeat some of the purpose, but until I can learn of a reliable and safe alternative (some suggest just putting an appropriately-sized resister in parallel, like what that extra bulb accomplishes) I can deal with it. I did see the fash in dual-bulb fixtures and my porch 4 bulb arrangement.

Jim

Same here in the UK; we have used a variety of CFL bulbs for 20 years and none have affected X-10 signals. It is the vacuum cleaner that sometimes causes problems for us.

-- John Perry