"Judge delays BlackBerry US shutdown"

Is that the best you've got, my poor typing?

What injunction? Could you point to where the trail court has issued an injunction? RIM has continued to sell balckberries during the entire process and even thru today. What have then been injoined from doing?

Nope. The finding of fact by the jury regarding prior art has already been rendered (verdict).

Again what injunction?

What??!!!??? It doesn't work the way you seem to think.

Well lieing in court is a good reason to have the trial judge take a shall we say less then sympathetic view. But in fact the trial judge has not to date evidenced the behavior you speak of. Feel free to point me to a news (not Op-Ed) articvle that suggests otherwise.

You are right there, his options are limited and those options all favor NTP. The remaining question is how much does RIM have to pay.

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

Have you seen the stories where the 'alternatives' are now sueing each other in patent disputes? The fun just never ends. If memory serves me, I think Visto has sued Good Technology (or the other way around) for some sort of infringement. This might actually be good for RIM, though I doubt it.

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

I think the problem is that you don't understand that appeals are still possible, based on what the judge does next.

Perry Mason would never stand for this ;-)

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

Wrong. Here's what _could_ happen:

1. The existing injunction, which has been stayed, could be declared invalid. A new injunction could be issued, and stayed, so RIM could deploy its software workaround. In fact, it was NTP that raised the possibility of a new injunction, which means that they understand that the software workaround would not infringe.

The danger here is that should Spencer invalidate the existing injunction, because of the invalidated patents, RIM could start a new appeals cycle, and Spencer doesn't want them to be able to do this.

1. Spencer could lift the stay and not invalidate the existing injunction. The danger in this is that it could give RIM grounds to appeal, based on the fact that the injunction covers invalidated patents.
2. RIM could get a whole new trial based on the invalidation of the patents. This is what NTP desperately wants to avoid.

Don't believe that the appeals are over if no settlement is reached. They're not.

Now you've completely lost me. I was going to point out that your example actually had nothing to do with patents, and then decided it would just unnecessarily confuse things.

Good article in March issue of the IEEE Spectrum, "

There is no existing injunction. The original injunction was vacated.

True.

If it works. If it's non-infringing. I suspect the court might well require RIM to demonstrate that it's non-infringing before granting a stay.

Nonsense.

Nope.

Nope.

Nope.

The only possible appeal at this point is on whatever ruling is issued by the court, and then only on the existing record.

In short, you are wrong on all counts.

I suggest you actually read it, carefully, because it contradicts much of what you are claiming. ;)

It's you that doesn't understand that.

Nope. You don't understand the law.

Because it doesn't exist except in your imagination.

RIM can only appeal the correctness of the relief, and then only on the existing record -- no new evidence can be introduced or considered.

Nope. RIM and NTP are now in endgame.

Proof? Have you actually read the record, or anything more than USA Today?

We know nothing of the kind.

Actually fabricating evidence.

Let's hear why a new set of appeals in a civil case such as this can be started?

This is what I'm not sure you grasp per facts in the case, there are no injunctions currently issued in this case. RIM has in fact (unless this has changed in the last day or so) not even been injoined from continuing to sell Blackberries.

The appeals process is over, the appeals courts have effectively ruled the trial judge has not made any mistakes in law. The SCOTUS has refused to hear the case effectively bowing to the appeals court who have 'bowed' to the trial judge. Appeals over. There is no basis at this point for an appeal. Once a ruling regarding amount is issued RIM can appeal the amount of money to pay, however based on the record this will not get very far.

When you find the article, check the date on it. This sound slike something that might have been written 4 years ago, not since the SCOTUS said no. This si what you don't understand there is no one left to appeal to. The original judgement cannot in law be vacated at this point unless NTP decides now that they have won, to give up.

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

Given a reasonable Judge (by this I mean not totally insane) there is nothing he can be expected to do that would form the basis of an appeal aside from an appeal for relief when the final dollar amount is set. This appeal when turned donw by the next level is the end of it. RIM will go through the motion as in this case the lawyer fees are likely lower then the award so what has RIM to lose, but RIM is screwed, best they can hope for is a few dollars less then effective bankruptcy.

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

OK

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

You trimmed where I asked repeatedly in thepost you ar ereplying to, so I will ask again, note shouting this time to ensure I have your attention:

WHAT INJUNCTION???

fundamentalism, fundamentally wrong.

Have you read anything about this case?

In 2003 Spencer issued an injunction forbidding RIM from ?directly making, using, offering to sell or selling within the United States or importing? its BlackBerry.

It's all really moot. RIM will either settle, or implement their workaround. Implementing the work-around will probably be better since the patents are all permanently invalidated then they'll have other avenues to pursue if they wish.

The judge needs to be very careful in what he does, or he can open the possibility of a whole new set of appeals by RIM.

d[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

Have you? Seriously? (Other than USA Today?)

RIM Provides Update On NTP Inc. Vs. RIM Litigation

Judgment and Injunction Vacated; Case Remanded To District Court

Waterloo, ON - Research In Motion (RIM) (Nasdaq: RIMM: TSX: RIM) provided an update today following receipt of a ruling this afternoon from the United States Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit in regard to the NTP Inc. vs. RIM litigation.

In response to RIM?s appeal of a judgment of the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia, the United States Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit ordered the judgment vacated and the case remanded to the District Court for further proceedings. The Court of Appeals also ordered the injunction (previously imposed and stayed by the District Court) vacated.

HINT: Look up the meaning of the legal term "vacated".

It is indeed. RIM has lost, and must either settle with NTP or face the legal consequences.

If RIM had a viable work-around it would have presumably deployed it by now, rather than running up a *lot* more liability (in the hundreds of millions of dollars), which it will still owe NTP even if the work-around is successful.

The only thing RIM can appeal is the correctness of the judgement, and then only on the existing record -- no new evidence can be introduced or considered. Game over.