Wireless bridge setup questions

I have a research farm that is getting a new supervisor and hw would like to have the internet ported over to the house from the calving barn. Not a big deal but I would really appreciate some feedback from some people that have more experience than myself in setting up the bridge.

I am planning on having the wireless router in the calving area, since that is where the majority of the people are as well as the print server. I was thinking of mounting an outdoor omni directional antenna paired with a 1W amplifier to get some range around the farm and then on the house mount a directional antenna aimed towards where the calving barn is also with a 1W amplifier and a repeater inside the house connected to the antenna.

Does this sound somewhat along the right approach? I also do not know if I need the amplifier for the house or not, but seeing in terms of time vs cost of an amplifier I figured it's best to order one and use it rather than waste time that will cost more than the amplifier.

I am also looking for specific equipment recommendations for what I am setting up.

Thanks in advance.

Reply to
Raptor
Loading thread data ...

Boosting signal beyond a certain point is illegal, and the fines can be stiff. Just as importantly, boosting signal at the access point will not help you if you are trying to connect to it with a laptop or some other low powered device since they will not be similarly "boosted." There also will be heavy self-interference if you do boost signals on connecting radios, since the sensitivity of the radio will be much higher than the gear designed for higher powered usage. You don't mention whether it's a 802.11 bridge you plan to use, but I'll assume it is.

If you don't require mobilility, something like a Tranzeo 802.11a bridge should provide what you are after and works cleanly to over a kilometer (more is very possible with different antenna choices). I have some used Tranzeo gear for sale (cheap) if there is an interest.

If you require mobility then likely that will mean either several access points placed around the are and wired together or equipping the end users with high powered gear.

Lots of choices available, 3Com has some good campus gear, etc.

Don't try to shoehorn low-cost consumer wireless bridges into this job, you are guaranteed trouble.

-- Steve Cole President, Kingston Online Services

formatting link
from WISP Forums:
formatting link

Reply to
Steve

Just as importantly, boosting signal at the access point will not help you if you are trying to connect to it with a laptop or some other low powered device since they will not be similarly "boosted." There also will be heavy self-interference if you do boost signals on connecting radios, since the sensitivity of the radio will be much higher than the gear designed for higher powered usage. You don't mention whether it's a 802.11 bridge you plan to use, but I'll assume it is.

should provide what you are after and works cleanly to over a kilometer (more is very possible with different antenna choices). I have some used Tranzeo gear for sale (cheap) if there is an interest.

points placed around the are and wired together or equipping the end users with high powered gear.

are guaranteed trouble.

The amplifiers I am looking at are from HyperLink technologies and say they are fully FCC compliant for 802.11, which you were correct in assuming. I am assuming that these would be within regulation to use, but I may be incorrect in assuming this. Part of the problem right now comes from the fact that I do not know the exact layout, yet, of the farm area. In terms of mobility, I do not know what they are wanting exactly, yet again lack of information that is being given to me, so I am assuming that they will want a bit of mobility around each area.

The main objective I want to get done is to be able to connect to the wireless at the house, or at the barn and also have the spots linked together. Add to the fact that my wireless experience past basic installs consisting of a few AP's a repeaters does not help me much here.

I am hoping to get out there tommorow and get some distances and location of things via a GPS. Once I have distance and obstacles in mind I should be able to get a better idea in what I want and don't want.

Reply to
Raptor

No. Not even close.

The problem is that you've supplied absolutely no numbers from which an appropriate recommendation can be assembled. There's also no clue as to whether there is an internet connection involved, it's bandwidth, and where it is currently located. What you need is dependent on some calculations involving range, topology, line of sight, Fresnel zone, required bandwidth, number of connections, type of traffic expected, and number of client computers. The range and line of sight are especially important.

I'm not sure I could supply a complete list of requirements sufficient to offer a recommendation, but for starters, I would ask:

  1. Range. How far between house and barn?
  2. Line of Sight? Include elevation of antennas at each end so that Fresnel Zone can be calculated.
  3. Traffic and bandwidth? How much bandwidth do you need between sites? Are you going to be doing high speed video over the link, or just casual web browsing? VoIP? Backups?
  4. Dollars? Is there a budgetary limit?
  5. How many connecting computers? Laptops? Wireless or Wired? Expected coverage area or radius? Connected to both ends?
  6. Any existing equipment that needs to be accommodated?

There's probably more things that would be useful, but this is a good start. It's highly likely that you will NOT need an amplifier as this creates an "alligator". That's an animal with a big mouth and small ears, that talks far farther than it hears. Such amplifiers are only useful for extending the range if both ends of the link have similar power amplifiers. Otherwise, they are just interference generators.

I can't tell why you mentioned using a high gain omnidirectional antenna for what appears to be a point to point link. Do you expect wireless clients to connect to this omni antenna and then to the internet? That might make sense if the wireless device at this omni antenna was also a wireless router with an internet connection. However, if the internet is at the other end of a WDS bridge, such a link will result in at least a 50% maximum bandwidth reduction.

Reply to
Jeff Liebermann

I have a setup going over a mile using just off the shelf D-link 800 AP and D-link 810 bridge. Of course they are tied to a couple of directional antenna (dbperformance.com). This setup has been flawless for the past 3 years. I would not spend the major bucks for commercial access points and bridge if you can find the Dlink stuff.

Reply to
Black Adder

"Black Adder" hath wroth:

Nice.

Big antennas make a BIG difference. There's also a direct relationship between speed and range (for a given antenna combination). +6dB gain increase means double the range (at the same speed). +12dB increase is 4 times the range. +18dB is 8 times. Etc.

Going from the stock +2dBi rubber ducky antennas, to big +24dBi barbeque grill dish antennas at each end, is a 44dB gain increase. 10^(dB/20) = 10^(44/20) = 160 times the range of the rubber ducky antennas, again at the same speeds.

The range also varies with the connection speed mostly because the receiver sensitivity decreases with increased speed. Very roughly, if you double the connection speed, the range decreases by a factor of

0.70. This works well for OFDM 802.11g speeds, but not for comparing 802.11b with 802.11g speeds.

Interesting antennas. The datasheets on the web page looks like they actually ran pattern tests on their antennas. However, I'm a bit suspicious about the advertised gains. Seems a bit high for the size of the antenna.

Reply to
Jeff Liebermann

Well, got a chance to go and get a view of the area they want wireless installed. And I must say it was a bit misrepresented in terms of how far it is between the areas they want access from. When I got there I could already easily see the one spot visibly from where the house is. But just to make sure I used a GPS to check the distance, and sure enough, it's not all that far. The distance between the two is 850ft with almost nothing inbetween. I had a DLink 1310 with me and figured I'd see how far it would get outside of the building I placed it in, which the metal clad barn. I just about made it to the house with its original omni antenna scanning with my Toshiba laptop. Glad I didn't commit to much into this before getting out and viewing the spot. I'm thinking now that am outdoor omni antenna at the barn with a omni repeater at the house will cover everywhere they want to be with their system. No need for any amplifiers or long distance bridging.

Anyway, now I just need to find an outdoor antenna that is rated to at least -40 degree operating tempature.

Reply to
Raptor

Just as importantly, boosting signal at the access point will not help you if you are trying to connect to it with a laptop or some other low powered device since they will not be similarly "boosted." There also will be heavy self-interference if you do boost signals on connecting radios, since the sensitivity of the radio will be much higher than the gear designed for higher powered usage. You don't mention whether it's a 802.11 bridge you plan to use, but I'll assume it is.

Steve if you intend to continue posting here, please configure your newsreader properly so that it wraps lines at ~70 chars. I presume that FUDForum can do this, if not I suggest getting one that can. At present your posts are largely illegible.

Reply to
Mark McIntyre

Cabling-Design.com Forums website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.