Kindle probs with MiFi

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I've seen this mentioned over on the Amazon Kindle forums...
Folks are unable to connect their Kindle ereaders or Fire tablets
to certain brands of MiFi units...

Any thoughts on why this might be happening ?

--  
/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/
No Good Deed -
         Goes Unpunished  



Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
On Mon, 8 Jul 2013 12:05:39 -0500, "ps56k"

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Possibly DHCP failure, 802.11Nl, and standby recovery.  I don't have a
VZW MiFi for testing.

I was at Best Buy last week and found that none of the various Kindles
on display would connect to any of their in house Wi-Fi systems.
However, they would connect if I power cycled the Kindle.  I
eventually got the attention of one of the Geek Squad techs, who said
that they had to use a static IP address because the DCHP client in
the Kindle is problematic.  

My neighbors brats received various Kindles for graduation.  They
wouldn't work with their also new Belkin router (forgot model number),
but worked fine with my DD-WRT Buffalo and some older ones that I
tried.  So, I brought home about 6 routers and tried them with a
Kindle Fire.  No problems with the older routers.  Anything with
802.11N enabled had problems but would eventually connect if I tried
multiple times.  I tried sniffing the traffic over the air and suspect
that the problem is the DHCP client in the Kindles.  A static IP
address worked by not reliably for some unknown reason.

As I mentioned, I could connect to most of the various wireless
routers exactly once with the Kindle Fire.  However, when the Kindle
went into standby, the only way I could recover the connection was to
power down and then back on.  I think I can safely say that the
problem is in the Kindle Fire, and not the various routers.

I can do some more testing if you're desperate, but I'm on vacation
(house arrest) this week and don't want to do anything that looks like
useful work.

This is to the Samsung WIS09ABGN LinkStick:
<(Amazon.com product link shortened)>


--  
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
What Buffalo are you running DD-WRT on. I often get asked  
recommendations for routers and I have a sample of one that works.  
[Works means no periodic booting.]

I never knew Kindles were picky. They have been around enough that you  
would think the bugs are out of them. [I'm still getting my books used,  
though do read technical pdfs on a tablet.]


Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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Ummm...  
<http://home.learnbydestroying.com:8080>
Buffalo WHR-HP-G54  
Uptime about 20 days.  No spontaneous reboots or hangs.  I'm not sure
if build 14896 is totally stable because the PPTP VPN daemon often
dies and has to be restarted from the command line.  Yep, it's dead
right now.  Maybe a later build will have fixed that.

Much as I like this particular router, it's old and getting difficult
to find.  I also prefer a router with 802.11n capability, which this
one lacks.  

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I don't know much about Kindle, but it looks like whomever built them
for Amazon decided to do everything themselves and from scratch.  The
possible lack of Wi-Fi Alliance certification is an important clue.

--  
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
There is some company that will decode PPTP captures for a fee. ;-) It  
is not suggested to be used for secure coms.

I'm on a Buffalo WZR-HP-G450H. Must be for a year by now. So far so  
good. The 2wire locked up a few days ago. Red light flashing. But the  
Buffalo keeps going.

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2403697,00.asp

At the time I bought mine, the dual band version had all sorts of  
complaints. That was one of the reasons I got the single band version.  
That and if it sucked, I would be out less money. ;-)

These magazine do all sorts of tests except the one that matters:  
uptime. Torture it with bit torrent. On a LAN, they should be able to  
get a few PC and flog the thing.

Most people only bit torrent over the internet, but there is nothing  
stopping someone setting up private torrents for testing.

A friend swears if you run multiple PCs on bit torrent, and then make  
sure each machine can see each other, the torrent gets done faster.  
Personally, I think this is nuts.







Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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Sounds perfectly logical to me, assuming you have Internet bandwidth to
spare. What am I missing?


Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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Not much. The machines will detect each other locally and will exchange
data amongst themselves, so this technique won't directly hurt you.

It also won't help you if you tune your torrent settings (number of
connections, simultaneous uploads/downloads, speed throttles, etc)
appropriately. If you don't, then torrenting from multiple machines may
help.

The one big real benefit is if you torrent from very slow hard drives,
or insist on running too many connections, have too little RAM for
cache, have your torrent client flushing to disk constantly, etc, in
which case more machines torrenting will split the load across multiple
spindles. Torrenting to a faster performing disk will solve the problem
much more cheaply.

--  
The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
On Wed, 10 Jul 2013 15:30:50 -0700, DevilsPGD

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Good point.  If you have your BitTorrent client set to use (for
example) 50% of your available bandwidth, two machines will use ALL of
your bandwidth, resulting in double the throughput.

--  
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
On 7/10/2013 4:31 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
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Well yeah, except you set the 50% limit so you had some bandwidth for  
other stuff. Now you are defeating the reason you set the limit.

As I said in the other post, it does make sense if your hardware is  
junker grade.


Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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Or just set it to use all of your bandwidth, and go Office Space on your
other junker computer.

--  
The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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I know.  I much prefer IPSEC but the CPU overhead is far to much for
the bottom of the line routers that I'm using.

Incidentally, for commodity wireless, I'm using refurbished Linksys
EA2700 on eBay for about $40.  Quite stable, no surprises, and
tolerable feature set.  
<http://stores.ebay.com/Linksys-Official-Store

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Nice.  I like the antenna farm and the stock DD-WRT firmware.

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Dual band has been a problem for me with literally every router I've
tried.  Sometimes, the problems are just plain stupid.  For example,
the EA2700 I mentioned will bridge between 2.4 and 5.7Ghz, but the
bridging performance is totally dismal, while the performance on
either 2.4 or 5.7GHz at the same time, comes to an almost complete
stop.  As soon as I stop moving data via the bridge, normal
performance returns.  Looks like someone didn't do much testing.

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I use a MAC address spoofer program that keeps generating new
connections until the router hangs.  Most of what I've tested these
days will discard old MAC addresses quite nicely.  I've run this test
on some of my routers without any problem.  However, that doesn't test
buffer exhaustion, which is the problem with BitTorrent.  Too many
simultaneous connections, gobbling too many buffers.  I can look
inside the box, determine the size of the working RAM, and make a good
guess as to how many connections it can handle.  I then set my Torrent
client to somewhat less, and it never hangs.  I don't do much
downloading with BitTorrent (mostly uTorrent) and have never hung any
of my routers except when I had too many connections going.

If you want to break things:
<http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/lanwan/lanwan-howto/31103-how-we-test-hardware-routers-revision-3
Try the max connections tool at:
<http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/mydownloads/max_session_tool.zip
Extra credit for running it between two wireless connections.  I think
I burned out a WRT54G running DD-WRT doing that repeatedly because it
was saving the MAC-to-IP address table in NVRAM.  Oops.

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<http://www.neubot.org/bittorrent-and-stream-tests-0.3.6

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Well, if the internet bandwidth is large (i.e. cable modem), and the
machines are old and slow, that seems possible.  Otherwise, I don't
think so.

--  
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
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Oh, the machines are old and he has plenty of them. [Garage sales.] That  
might be it. The BBC stuff I download (er allegedly download, neither  
confirming nor denying here) is generally at the max of my crappy  
1.5mbps DSL. Downloading linux via bit torrent always maxes out my DSL.

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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Amazon doesn't care, even if you manage to make it through the "Reboot
your router" level of customer support (which I did)

If you really need to download books on an unsupported wifi connection,
the 3G option isn't that much more expensive and it solves the problem
entirely by taking the need for wifi out of the picture.

--  
The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi

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Problematic is a generous word for it; it's downright terrible. And the
DHCP client itself isn't the only issue, it's got some network stack
issues (some resolved, some not)

--  
The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.

Re: Kindle probs with MiFi
On Mon, 08 Jul 2013 16:36:57 -0700, DevilsPGD

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Groan.  The big problem for me is that the various Kindle devices do
NOT support WPA2-RADIUS encryption or EAP certificate based
authentication.  That causes problems in hospitals, skools, large
corporations, and some of my schemes.  

Incidentally, I sorta blundered across this site:
<http://www.lab126.com
Looks like Kindle development.

I also tried to find Kindle devices in the wi-fi alliance search pages
and found only something called the Whitney reader.
<http://certifications.wi-fi.org/pdf_certificate.php?cid=WFA12463
Nothing else.  Maybe there's a problem getting certified?

--  
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

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