Centurylink ISDN? [telecom]

This week, I called Centurylink [to find out about getting ISDN service for a customer I know]. When I reached their business office and asked who I needed to call to find out about ISDN services, they told me they had never heard of ISDN (they actually asked me what ISDN stood for. So I told them it stood for Integrated Services Digital Network). Then she asked me if I meant VOIP. I said no. Then she asked me if I meant DSL. Again I said no. They even went so far as to tell me that I needed to call the company that provides ISDN because Centurylink does not provide it.

Excuse me?

Someone I know gave me the number to the ISDN bureau at Centurylink (I'm fortunate that he had it). I called and told her that I couldn't get pre-sales information about ISDN. I told her that their business office told me that they didn't know what ISDN was or who handled it. I told her that their business office denied that Centurylink even offered it. She was appalled. So she put me on hold and called the business office herself. When she picked me up again, she told me that she was told the same thing when she called the business office.

But the lady from the ISDN bureau did refer me to an account rep that was able to answer my questions and get me a written quote for possible service.

I think it is very sad how poorly Telco CSRs are trained. I had a very similar issue when I was a kid and wanted to get a QKT coupler installed on my home line [so I could plug a phone patch into it for use with my ham station]. They knew what a QKT coupler was but their supervisor had the nerve to tell me that what I wanted to use it for was against Telco's tariffs. I kept having exchanges with the business office which never resulted in them agreeing to put one on my line. I only got it resolved because I had a ham radio friend that worked at the Telco marketing office. Once I told them to call him, the problem got resolved. Then I got my QKT coupler on my line.

I've had so many horror stories dealing with different Telco business offices simply because they provide inferior training to their CSRs.

I've published a number of horror stories on Telecom Digest about not being able to get foreign listings without resorting to calling PSCs in the different states I've lived in. And I have had to do that in SC, NC, and GA to get my foreign listings. I even went round and round with the NM PUC without success.

And I've had to contact PSCs to resolve order issues with Telcos a number of times over the years. If their people knew what they were doing, I wouldn't have had to resort to that. And they are always upset because I called the PSC and never mind that I couldn't get it resolved any other way.

I was renting a room in Maryland years ago. My landlord was bad about mailing them the monthly check. He had the money but he'd forget to put it in the mail. I paid him for my share of the utilities on time every month. Twice, our phone service was interrupted for non-payment. The first time my grandmother died and my family had to call the county police to have someone come to the house and have me call home. The second time, my first niece was about to be born any day.

After the second time, I called Telco and ordered my own line. They told me I'd have to pay a two hundred dollar deposit and never mind that I had a perfect record of payment on my previous phone in Maryland, my phone in SC, and my phone in NC. So I called the PSC and then Telco decided I didn't need to pay any deposit after all. So they came out and put my phone in. That was the only way I could resolve the issue with them.

And I could tell more horror stories.

Do I have a problem with Telco business offices? Sadly, I think I do.

Fred

***** Moderator's Note *****

I had a disappointing session with a Verizon CSR who insisted that I had to buy both caller-id and caller-id-with-name if I wanted the former, and who also told me that I couldn't get call-forwarding or conference calling unless I bought a package that included call-waiting.

I'm not sure it's a matter of poor training, though: I suspect that CSR's are being taught that customers are sheep who'll believe anything they're told, and that they should lie like the devil to bump their sales. It's the wrong *kind* of training, but I've seen and heard too many stories like yours to believe that it's not intentional.

Bill Horne Moderator

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fatkinson.remove-this
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[snip]

I've been getting calls recently from AT&T telephone solicitors trying to sell me Uverse Internet service in Texas (used to be Southwestern Bell here). I *might* be interested, depending on the terms. There are a couple of things I want to make sure of first.

  1. Show me in writing where it says I can run a mail server without violating AT&T's Terms of Service. 2. How much do I have to pay for the service, before *and* after the promotional period runs out? 3. It has to be a better deal than what I've got now.

I've gotten some astounding statements from them:

  1. It is *illegal* for AT&T sales reps to discuss sales tax. When I called them on this one, they said it was company policy (because they get it wrong so often, and that I'll believe), and proceeded to tell me why there is no difference between AT&T company policy and a law. Unfortunately, I think AT&T management really believes this. Does AT&T think they have the death penalty?

  1. AT&T will not shut off my account if I use it to threaten the life of the President of the United States. I asked about this hoping they would point me to the Terms of Service on their web site, and find the stuff about servers right next to it. I eventually found the part that says they *WILL* shut off my account if I use it for illegal purposes, which certainly includes threatening the President, with no help from the telephone solicitors who denied such a document exists.

  2. 6 Megabit DSL is too slow to run a mail server. Funny, they didn't say anything about the upload speed here. If they thought I meant the Yahoo or Google mail server, they're right, but I'm talking about something smaller than a small 3-person office mail server receiving a moderate amount of spam. A 64k ISDN line should be plenty for just mail. It's also odd that it's working well now, on 1.5 megabit DSL, using another ISP and DSL supplied by, surprise,
*AT&T*. Also, one telephone solicitor believed that attempting to run something over a DSL link that is too slow "voids the modem and damages the warranty". Yes, he said it that way twice.

Way long time ago (late 1980's), it was possible to run a mail *and news* server using 1200 bps modems and dialup lines and an 8MHz

68000 processor. Granted, the news traffic load was a lot lower then. At one point we even had TCP/IP set up over it, not just UUCP.

  1. Their DSL comes with a comprehensive security package and virus protection. In spite of the fact that I had to tell them at least

3 times how to pronounce "FreeBSD", they insisted that it would run on FreeBSD. I suppose they will tell me it runs on Eniac or Arduino next.

  1. The sales rep couldn't think of any tax on my *local phone bill* besides sales tax and long distance calls. There is no 911 fee on my internet service but he finally admitted that there is a a month 914 fee. What's a 914 fee? I don't know, but I kept incrementing the number each call after they denied the existence of the fee for the next question.

  2. My current DSL (despite repeated warnings from me that I did
*NOT* have cable) operates over lines shared with my neighbors. Well, if they were referring to the Internet "backbone", they're right, but it was obvious they were confusing existing DSL with cable.

  1. No, we won't tell you the full terms of the deal until you sign up for it. The deal was stated as .95/month for 12 months. Oh, yes, there's also 0 for a modem. And a 0 contract termination fee. And the regular price is .95/month (This is a deal-breaker, and I suspect the bill will be more like /month including all the taxes and fees). And no, if I don't like the deal after it's connected up, they won't pay to get back my current connection.

  2. You are/were advised to get the deal in writing and get the full terms of the deal before signing by, *SURPRISE*, an AT&T commercial (about 1992, referring to alternative long-distance carriers). The current crowd of AT&T telephone solicitors, according to one, is unable to send out any type of paper, not even toilet paper. And apparently they don't have access to email or fax, either. And they can't give out a URL more specific than "on our web site" for the Terms of Service (there are multiple sets for different services).

  1. My current ISP charges 9. My current ISP charges $0.41/month in sales tax. Why do you charge almost 4 times that for the promotional $19.95/month rate? They had no answer. (The first $25/month in internet service is not subject to sales tax in Texas. But I'm not so sure the phone company would classify it that way, or that they've ever heard of this law.)

    .41/month in sales tax. Why do you charge almost 4 times that for the promotional .95/month rate? They had no answer. (The first /month in internet service is not subject to sales tax in Texas. But I'm not so sure the phone company would classify it that way, or that they've ever heard of this law.)

***** Moderator's Note *****

I invited AT&T to comment on this article, but there has been no reply as of one hour beyond the publication deadline I gave.

Bill Horne Moderator

Reply to
Gordon Burditt
+--------------- | I've been getting calls recently from AT&T telephone solicitors | trying to sell me Uverse Internet service in Texas (used to be | Southwestern Bell here). I *might* be interested, depending on the | terms. There are a couple of things I want to make sure of first. | 1. Show me in writing where it says I can run a mail server without | violating AT&T's Terms of Service. 2. How much do I have to pay | for the service, before *and* after the promotional period runs | out? 3. It has to be a better deal than what I've got now. +---------------

  1. See if you can get them to admit that once you've switched over to UVerse that, even *if* you have a week's worth (say) of local UPS powering *all* your in-home equipment [including their CPE!], your new UVerse telephone & internet service will only survive for as little as 4-6 hours during a neighborhood-wide power outage. Surprise! Surprise! [The door-to-door UVerse sales guy who visited a friend of mine recently actually *said* "4.5 hrs" to him, but who knows how long it would really be?]

See the recent "power outage" thread here in Telecom for more on this...

+--------------- | I've gotten some astounding statements from them: .... | 9. My current ISP charges $0.41/month in sales tax. Why do you | charge almost 4 times that for the promotional $19.95/month rate? | They had no answer. (The first $25/month in internet service is | not subject to sales tax in Texas. But I'm not so sure the phone | company would classify it that way, or that they've ever heard | of this law.) +---------------

If Texas law is similar to California law in this regard, it may be that the "promotional" rate is classified in state law as a "rebate", and that you have to pay sales tax on the *full retail* amount of the item or service. This was certainly the case when I bought my current smartphone [yes, at an AT&T store]: the non-contract price was ~$600, but the two-year contract price was only $200. Nevertheless, I had to pay sales tax on the full $600!! Other states have similar laws, e.g.:

formatting link
Many quirks in Florida's sales tax laws By Mark Albright, Times Staff Writer In Print: Friday, October 29, 2010 ... Since 1965, Florida has required retailers to slap the state tax on the full price of taxable items bought with coupons or manufacturers' rebates. Few shoppers notice - the calculation is buried in the register tape and most coupon deals apply to foods that are tax-free.

But there are plenty of taxable items - cleaning products, batteries, restaurant bills, soft drinks, even manufacturer rebates for new cars - where buyers must pay the sales tax on the full price, not the price they actually paid.

As defined by the Legislature, any reimbursement a store gets from a supplier after the sale is part of the taxable price. ...

-Rob

+--------------------------------------------------------------+ Rob Warnock 627 26th Avenue San Mateo, CA 94403
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Rob Warnock

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