Bell System trivia... [Telecom]

I was looking at some old Bell System information a few days ago and wondered this: How many states had more than one Bell System company serving their territory? Since we're coming up on the 25th anniversary of the AT&T divestiture (on 1-1-09) I thought we should dust off our knowledge and memories and share them with A.D.T. readers

I didn't have a definitive reference source for my question and could only think of three examples (see below). But surely there are more.

Who can name them?

The three I know of are Oregon (Pacific Northwest Bell and Mountain Bell [dba Malheur Home Telephone Company]), Idaho (PNB and Mountain Bell) and Ohio (Ohio Bell and Cincinnati Bell [which I think was really the Cincinnati and Suburban Telephone Company]

Al

Reply to
Al Gillis
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Connecticut: New York Tel and SNET

It is my impression that Oat said that the part of Indiana closest to Chicago was handled by Illinois Bell for a while,

Reply to
John Levine

I was looking at some old Bell System information a few days ago

> and wondered this: How many states had more than one Bell System > company serving their territory? Since we're coming up on the 25th > anniversary of the AT&T divestiture (on 1-1-09) I thought we should > dust off our knowledge and memories and share them with A.D.T. > readers. I didn't have a definitive reference source for my question > and could only think of three examples (see below). But surely there > are more. > > Who can name them? > > The three I know of are Oregon (Pacific Northwest Bell and Mountain > Bell [dba Malheur Home Telephone Company]), Idaho (PNB and Mountain > Bell) and Ohio (Ohio Bell and Cincinnati Bell [which I think was > really the Cincinnati and Suburban Telephone Company]

John Levine replied:

Connecticut: New York Tel and SNET > > It is my impression that Oat said that the part of Indiana closest > to Chicago was handled by Illinois Bell for a while,

The situation in southwestern CT where NYTel existed is rather oommon throughout the (continental) US. You have a central office switch in one state owned by one BOC providing dialtone service to customers in an adjacent state which otherwise is served by a different BOC. I'll try to compile a list for posting later on, since it is rather numerous and involved.

But the situation where a BOC in one state crosses over to another state (otherwise served by a different BOC) in a more significant way where there are several central office switches in the adjacent state is more rare.

Cincinnati Bell serves both Ohio (otherwise Ohio Bell, as mentioned), and also the Kentucky suburbs of Cincinnati OH (KY is otherwise served by South Central Bell). Ohio Bell (SBC once Ameritech) and South Central Bell (BellSouth) are both known as part of the new AT&T now.

As mentioned, Idaho was mostly Mountain Bell in the southern part, but Pacific Northwest Bell (once part of Pacific Telephone) a narrow strip in central Idaho. North Idaho is solidly GTE (now Verizon). Both Mountain Bell and Pacific Northwest Bell are part of US West now Qwest. Pacific Telephone (Pacific Bell or Pacific Telesis, and also once SBC) is part of the new AT&T.

Yes, it is true that the northwestern corner of Indiana was at one time part of Illinois Bell. In the mid 1970s (I think), it was transferred to Indiana Bell. Both IL and IN are part of SBC one Ameritech, now part of the new AT&T. Northwestern Indiana is part of the Chicago and vicinity LATA though.

At about the same time that northwestern Indiana was transferred from Illinois Bell to Indiana Bell (mid 1970s?), some exchanges in western south-central Illinois, across the river from St.Louis MO, were transferred from Southwestern Bell to Illnois Bell. Both Southwestern Bell (SBC) and Illinois Bell (SBC once Ameritech) are part of the new AT&T. A larger segment of western south-central Illinois is part of the St.Louis and vicinity LATA though.

Prior to either divstiture (1984) or the two year preparation for divestiture (1982 and 83), most of what is now the El Paso TX LATA was served by Mountain Bell. It was transferred to Southwestern Bell in the early 1980s. Mountain Bell became part of US West now Qwest. Southwestern Bell (SBC) is now part of the new AT&T.

These are the only ones I can think of offhand where a BOC in one state crosses over SIGNIFICANTLY into an adjacent state otherwise served by a different BOC, where there are actual central office switches in that adjacent state --

To summarize:

- Cincinnati Bell in OH (otherwise Ohio Bell) and Kentucky (otherwise South Centra Bell);

= Pacific Northwest Bell in ID (otherwise Mountain Bell);

- Northwestern Indiana served by Illinois Bell, at one time, while Indiana was otherwise served by Indiana Bell;

- western south-central Illinois served by Southwestern Bell, at one time, while Illinois was otherwise served by Illinois Bell;

- El Paso (western Texas) served by Mountain Bell, at one time, while Texas was otherwise served by Southwestern Bell;

The Malheur Home (Bell) Telephone Company in Oregon is a special case where Mountain Bell acquired Malheur Home, which had been an independent telco. I think that to this day, Malheur is treated specially by the holding BOC, which should now be Qwest (US West).

BTW, prior to the 1930s? (I think, maybe it was prior to the 1920s?), northeastern New Jersey was served by New York Tel, but it was transferred to New Jersey Bell. Note that Bell Atlantic did takeover NYNEX circa 1997, and since 2000 it is all Verizon.

And as for Verizon, I am NOT counting any instancs of Verizon that was once GTE or Contel that is still held by Verizon (which has sold off large segments of one-time GTE and Contel after acquiring them in 2000), exists throughout states of "bona-fide" BOCs.

Also, prior to the 1910s (maybe 1900?), there were all kinds of franchised "Bell" telcos all over the US, and their boundaries did NOT follow state lines. You could have parts of two or more of these "Bell" franchisees operating in individual states. I think that by the early part of the 20th Century, AT&T realigned most of these to conform nicely with state lines, the exceptions retained being the ones we've been mentioning, although some (but not all) of those few exceptions were further streamlined in the early 1980s in time for divestiture.

And as I said, there were/are numerous other "smaller" state-border instances of a BOC "Spilling over" into an adjacent state otherwise served by a different BOC, but there is only one "rate area" in the adjacent state, and it gets it's dialtone from the "host state's" BOC. It will take some time to compile a comprehensive list of such. And while these still do exist, some of them were indeed streamlined and realigned in the 1980s "early divestiture" period, where the adjacent state's BOC acquired the franchise and had to build a remote switch as well. Sometimes LATA boundries were shifted as well. But local calling across state and/or LATA and/or BOC boundaries was (usually) still retained in those cases.

Finally, remember that Nevada Bell was actually a subsidiary of Pacific Telephone, going way back. And Delaware's BOC Diamond State Telephone was also a subsidiary of Bell of Pennsylvania, going way back. Both have been listed as individual BOCs in some lists, but sometimes, the "count" of total BOCs did NOT uniquely count Bell of Nevada, or Delaware's DST. BTW, the entire state of Delaware is DST (Verizon once Bell Atlantic) for its incumbent telco. And the entire state of Delaware is a part of the southeastern Pennsylvania (Philadelphia and vicinity) LATA.

- A/B

Reply to
Anthony Bellanga

The switch GNWCCTGNDS0 is in Greenwich and handles all but one of VZ's Greenwich prefixes. The adjacent hamlet of Byram is partly served from that switch and partly from PTCHNYPCDS0 in Port Chester NY. Greenwich 203-864 is served from WHPLNYWP06N in White Plains, which also handles a grabbag of VZ and non-VZ prefixes in NY, probably all pagers.

Welcome to Connecticut. Greenwich has been a commuter suburb of NYC for a long time. It's only 28 miles to Manhattan, and there's good train service. Greenwich is also extremely rich, and I'm sure there were always plenty of people who'd pay good money to be able to talk both to local merchants and to NYC. When SNET was expanding down from New Haven and NYT expanding up from NYC, NYT evidently got there first.

etc etc

And Greenwich.

R's, John

Reply to
John Levine

There is (or was) a similar situation further north, between eastern Dutchess Cty (NY) and the adjacent area of CT.

Reply to
Julian Thomas

Right after the divestiture I was working on a paging terminal installed in a Bell CO. There was Bell System blue/yellow stripe tape run across the floors, around racks, up the walls and all over to mark what was whose. The the yellow (or was it blue?) side was the new entity and the other was AT&T. I got a chuckle out of this, but the big laugh came when I went to the men's room. Someone had run the tape up the wall, neatly bisecting a urinal.

- Ron

Reply to
Ron Kritzman

For a very long time the Southgate exchanges in RI used to handle traffic for SE MA, still do. Used to be able to dial them with just 7D too, now they're on 508-336 and 508-761, still a non-toll dial from Providnece, RI.

The switch that serves them is in Pawtucket, RI.

Reply to
T

The history of Mountain Bell ("Muttering Machines to Laser Beams") tells that they did the taping as well. But it was very hard to do since so much of the equipment was in shared service and hard to assign to one company or the other. They made arbitrary decisions they knew made no sense, but had no choice.

Too bad no one back then ever compiled the cost of divesture.

Reply to
hancock4

snipped-for-privacy@bbs.cpcn.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@d45g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:

The true cost of divestiture was in the many jobs that were lost due to the new environment that was created by the courts in the name of competition.

The Bell Telephone split was beneficial to the them MCI's of the world. It also gave legacy telepone companies the ability to venture into other business lines only to fail (AT&T - Olivetti/NCR).

Not to mention a near collapse of all telephone manufacturing in the US (WECo with a French accent)!!!

The great consolidation in Telecom as embodied with the remaining Verizon & the New AT&T empires are a tribute to the final act of

1/1/1984.

Bill

Reply to
Bill

Cincinnati Bell serves both Ohio (otherwise Ohio Bell, as mentioned),

>and also the Kentucky suburbs of Cincinnati OH (KY is otherwise served >by South Central Bell). Ohio Bell (SBC once Ameritech) and South Central >Bell (BellSouth) are both known as part of the new AT&T now.

It's not a BOC, but there is (or was) a small family-owned telco just South of Louisville that served Bullitt and maybe one or two other counties. I forget the name - perhaps Alltell? Seems like I read they've been assumed by the Borg, like fifteen, twenty years ago.

Reply to
Randall Webmail

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