Smoke Det. Search

System sensor make some good smokes in many flavors.

Jim Rojas

ABLE_1 wrote:

Do they have "Smoked Salmon" flavor? If they do, it would go good with bagels.

Bagels are usually served with Lox, which is raw Salmon if my memory serves me right. Don't mind me...too many Grey Goose drinks this evening.

Jim Rojas

Roger W wrote:

Not bad for a genital... err I mean Gentile. Actualy Lox is cured Salmon. But smoked is close enough. Grey Goose? Sounds kinky.

Jim,

I already had checked System Sensor and ESL but could not find any that will meet the requirements that I would like.

This is kind of a unusual situation.

I am being asked to install a fire alarm system in a 3 story motel. The owner is requesting that the smokes in each room only alert in that room only but be auto-reset rather than system reset.

I initially thought that would be possible but once I started the search for such a detector I started to hit walls. I would rather not have to install

115v smokes into this project if I don't have to.

• * * * Hey Nick are you reading this. If anyone knows, Nick will know.

Thoughts or suggestions gracefully accepted.

Have a good weekend all.

Les

Thats how DC smoke detectors work. Unless something has changed, only

110V smoke detectors all sound off at the same time. To get a DC smoke to auto reset is a violation of NFPA72. You can setup the zone to verify the alarm, but as far as auto reset without a panel reset breaks some NFPA72 rules I believe.

Try Firex and Hochiki smokes.

Jim Rojas

ABLE_1 wrote:

I believe Gentex makes a unit that does what you want it to do, though you may have to go with a photo vs ion. check out

Good hunting,

Bill

Jim,

I don't believe NFPA 72 prevents the automatic resetting of room smoke detectors. Indeed, based on the Hotel occupancy NFPA 101 (2003)specifically states that sleeping room smoke detectors are NOT to activate the general building alarm (see 28.3.4.2).

Most hotel occupancies that I have been involved with do something similar to what he is trying to accomplish.

Regards,

Bill

DSC Meridian will meet this. We've used the GE 448CSRH

That is not really an unusual situation at all. Motels and hotels are often required to do it that way. Individual room detectors are "local" and self-restoring. That way if a guest triggers one with hair spray, cidgar smoke or whatever the whole place doesn't get evacuated.

The problem you face is that low voltage smoke detectors have to be connected to a FACP and the panel will go into alarm (alerting all guests or at least those on certain floors in a high rise) if a smoke zone goes into alarm. There may be a FACP that can do what you ask but self-restoring, system connected smokes are another matter.

I believe Gentex makes a unit that does what you want it to do, though you may have to go with a photo vs ion. check out

DSC Meridian will meet this. We've used the GE 448CSRH

Thanks I think that is what I was looking for.

It seems that the Gentex and the GE does it. However I could not find any info on the DSC to say that it does. No matter, since the GE does I will most likely go with that one.

Thanks again.

Les

DC smokes with sounders can be made to all sound at once -- just use a reversing relay. On the rest we agree.

I was going to suggest the gentex line but ssome one beat me to it.

Would it not be possible to power the smokes in the rooms from an Aux. Power Supply and leave it at that. The smokes in the halls and common areas would be zoned and give a general alarm which would signal the horn/strobes through out the building including the rooms.

Would this not meet the need for local in each room and general everywhere???

I think he's actually looking for a DC smoke *alarm*, and not a system smoke detector. Many of the four wire DC smoke alarms will "auto reset" (just as your 110VAC smoke alarms will) when the smoke source is removed (or clears the sensing chamber).

Yes. I would suggest a *supervised* auxiliary power supply and use power supervision relays (if you're going to monitor smoke status in the room). GE makes a DC powered four wire smoke alarm with integral PSR. The AHJ will often want a system heat detector in each room the GE 448 series smoke alarm will meet this requirement.

Perhaps, but that arrangement would not provide supervision of the power which is required on smoke detection systems.

What does the AHJ expect?

So far the following is what has been sent in writing.

NFPA 72 4.4.5 Smoke detector shall be in vicinity of FACP.

Plans shall clearly indicate locations of Horn/Strobes w/ decibel level and light levels for each.

NFPA 72 4.4.1.4.2.3 Location of circuit disconnect means shall be permanently identified at the FACP and shall be indicated on the plans.

If fire alarm is not monitored signage in compliance with Section

907.4.4 of the 2003 International Fire Code shall be provided at each manual pull station.

Presently working on drawings, design and parts list for proposal.

Once I get a little further I will contact AHJ to see if what I am proposing will fit his cup of tea. I think it will be just fine if it is done right. One of the big hurdles was finding the smoke that would meet the desired effect. Most DC detectors that I have used "latch" until a power reset. The auto reset is a new thought for me.

As for power to the smoke for the rooms, it would seem to me that if the smoke loop has an End of Line Relay that is connected to a supervisory zone it should work just fine.

Anything I am missing here??

Thanks again, very helpful.

Les