Installers in Kentucky beware of HB-41

Installers will have to charge more for their services. More people will choose to DIY and shop online.

Hmm. OK, that works for me. :^)

If it's set up correctly I can big benefits for installers and technicians as well. Many states regulate the alarm industry. Do you know what state Kentucky is going to model their alarm bill on??

RHC: Regulation, intelligently done (rare), and controlled in some fashion so it doesnt't morph into another revenue generating,self serving government regulatory agency, can benefit our industry by ensuring standards are met for those who serve the security buying public. But in spite of those benefits, what it can also do is drive those "little alarm dealers" out of the industry who for one reason or another just don't want to be bothered with this, or who refuse rto obey on principle. This leaves more potential victims exposed for the ADT's and other Borg companies to gouge even more of buying public, since they WILL take the time and put up with the extra expense to follow any level of regulation. They must be smiling all the way to the bank...

I don't know the nature of these new regulatory restrictions, so I can't say this will happen for sure, but is just seems like another in a long list of actions taken by governments to improve things, but which more often than not, turn out to have just the opposite effect.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see......

Still waiting to see that trick. Hasn't happened here.

RHC: Nor has it happened where I come from either. Regulation equals bullshit equals more regulation which brings on a new round of bullshit to fix the first round. Its a whole different mindset in Canada......

As I read it Robert, DIY can buy the equipment but only an approved person can give advise as to what to buy or how it works.. It like you got what you got but I can't help you understand how it works..

No clue Never seen this kind of BS before. (However the KBFAA ie NBFAA figures in the text of the bill. they recommend members for the board and only them..)

Theres a point in the text that exempts businesses with 500,000.00 in revenue from some section of the bill.. Now who do you think that favors.. (sure not the little guy) no big secret for me to see who's behind the thing...

Take a note that some of the requirements for service tech, electrical engineering degree BA with 2 yrs OJT or electrical engineering degree AD with 4 yrs OJT.. OK how many of you guys have a BA or AD in electrical engineering

But even if you do have a degree that only means they'll examine you to see if you look good enough to them... Still no assurance they'll accept you application.

Correct.

That's not correct. Anyone can give free advice, even a salesman. For example, most alarm salesmen working for medium to large companies aren't licensed technicians. They're given very basic training in what their particular alarm company likes to sell and then they go out and design "professionally" installed systems. This is in fact a frequent topic in this newsgroup -- salesmen who don't know how to design or install *designing* alarm systems that either can't be installed as planned, won't work effectively as planned or will cause false alarms if installed as planned.

There's no law in most places against unlicensed salesmen telling homeowners what to use and where to use it. Fortunately for my clients, I've designed, installed and serviced alarms for many years. This isn't something unique or special. Many of the online merchants in the trade are also alarm dealers and can also offer technical support.

A large portion of my time is spent doing just that -- explaining how things work and how to install them. It's not rocket science though. Anyone with a modicum of tool skills and a bit of patience can do install their own security alarm system. It may take a little longer than it would for an experienced pro but the cost savings can be significant and there's no requirement of a long-term contract. Furthermore, when the homeowner decides to DIY his alarm system he doesn't have to worry about being "locked out" of programming even after paying for the system.

Hahahahaha.... There it is.

I should have mentioned that only people capable of holding a job should undertake installing an alarm. All others need not apply.

Can you say UL. I knew that you could.

Another independent organization trying to get themselves legislated into a state of monopoly power and control.

Hummmmm that would be why you dont install anymore, and that you dont have a job for the last how many years ?

you had to build a website to get money from poor guys that were thinking to upgrade there supervised system and putting them at risk of having there contract null so that you can still have some income..

we do understand now why you have such a good bbb record!

who could have a good bbb record when they cant keep a job...

Wrong (as usual). Some states regulate the sales people too. BC springs to mind. Your own state (Florida) does too.

And most don't want to be.

Sort of like you??

But identifying possible design "inefficiencies" is the job of the professional technician/installer (who will also make recommendations for additional protection if it's warranted). The sales and installation departments work as a team, Bass. One covers the other. And most sales people are committed professionals.

I'm sure this last statement isn't something you told your "clients". And properly laying out an effective alarm system *is* pretty "unique and special".

Yup. And most answer their phones and emails. Some even take the step of becoming BBB *members*.

You mean when they can actually get a hold of you.

It's *still* a science.

"Skills" aren't the only things required. There are some specialty tools needed as well. You have to have some code knowledge as well as be pretty savvy in construction techniques. But I'm sure you're able to provide all this information in the two hour telephone course you offer your "clients".

I've been called in to "fix" a lot of DIY jobs. The potential "cost savings" could very well turn into a huge liability if you drill in the wrong place or improperly install the equipment. As for the "long term commitment", that sometimes works to the advantage of the consumer. You have to be able to read the fine print in the contract.

That's such a big issue with you, isn't it? Most end-users don't have a problem with this (and aren't interested in programming their own panels). You cater to a very small percentage of the DIY community. Quite frankly, most don't shop your kludge store. I never see anyone in CHA recommend your "services" (except you, of course).

If you can find a copy of the bill look in section 4 para. 4, "only retail stores or catalog sales NOT offering installations or CONSULTING SERVICES are exempt from the requirement.." its in black and white..

experienced

Robert doesn't "consult". He "advises". ;-)

The Statute, at one time, stated "on site" sales. The "on site" was deleted by the legislature and now includes phone sales.

It is no secret that Florida is heavily regulated. Now, the Florida Police Chiefs Association has unaminiouly past the adoption of a statewide model ordinance (approx. 485 muni's) which includes registration by the user whether it is monitored or not. If it is monitored, it must be monitored by a State licensed company. The DIY market is going to be included in the next rewrite by default. Right now, the first thought on the committee's mind is in order to register the alarm, it must be inspected by an electrical inspector first and checked by a state licensed contractor. I invision a new market for companies to just do inspections somewhat like home inspection companies for the insurance industry. This isn't necessarily pointed at DIY but at systems that are in use that are not associated with a licensed company. DIY just happens to fall into that category.

Bob W.

UL isn't even truly independent. Know what that "U" stands for?