Cellular Radio.

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Both Verizon and ATT provide Cellular "Boosters" for customer who use their
 cellular service but can't get a good signal in their home. I'm thinking t
hat they are just providing a connection between the customers cell phone a
nd the LAN to obtain VoIP telephone service. But I'm thinking it may be som
ething more than that because I think if you turn off the WiFi on your cell
 phone you can still get on the Internet.  
  
Does anyone know if a Cellular alarm radio can use this "Booster" to transm
it signals to central station?

Re: Cellular Radio.
Hi Jim,

From all the customers that I have come across that do use those devices, i
t appears that they are just routing your calls thru the internet and in es
sence, somewhat like a VoIP line.

The devices used to be freely given to customers who were access challenged
. Now, they are charging customers close to $200 for the device. The custom
ers went from being 'access challenged' to 'squeezed victims'. Usually, the
 cellular company is the only one in the area, and knows that they have a m
onopoly. Therefore, they can charge and know that most customers will end u
p paying.

Unlike a VoIP device that allows you to call anyone from any internet conne
ction in the country, the booster device has to be tagged to your cellular  
service account. Therefore, trying to use a booster for an alarm cellular r
adio would not be unabled for that commercial unit. It is somewhat related  
to how your cellphone works. All cellular radios for consumers use access p
oint names, which route your calls, text, and pictures in different ways th
ru the internet. I learned about 4 years ago to have different access point
 names/parameters in my cellphone. Depending on what area I may be in, I ca
n quickly switch my access point name and get better service for my cellpho
ne calls. It does take time to know what works where, thru trial and error.
 I have been with GSM phones for quite a while now, and this is what works  
best for me. Since I am using Sim Cards in my phones, I would not know if t
his would work on the CDMA systems.

Cell phone connections thru the towers can be routed any which way they wan
t. It is all internet connections, whether thru wires or tower waves. In em
ergencies, they have the ability to route calls from one area to any other  
area. The towers throughout the USA are basically electrical connection 'wi
res' that can be made to connect to any other connection. Picture the old s
witchboard operators who used to pull one wire out and connect it to anothe
r jack to make a phone connection.

Earlier in the year, we did have a customer who had sporadic telco service  
way up on a mountain. The Lodge was for the residents of the area, and the  
homeowners association had an ATT commercial modem, basically creating an i
nternet connection in a special cellular box with about 20' of cable length
 and antenna at the end. That unit put out an internet connection that was  
then hooked up to a router. The router put out wifi for the guests as well  
as wired ports. One port was then hooked up to an Ip card for the security  
system to communicate with.

It was a clean and ideal connection with little cost to the customer. In es
sence, it was a cellular radio allowing any internet connection to it.
  
We use both ATT and Verizon radios for alarm system connections depending o
n which service is better or preferable.

Perhaps others have more relevant information to come.

Have a great day.

Re: Cellular Radio.
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widely used item in our area for alarm cellular xmiters without an  
external antenna..

http://www.zboost.com/

item comes in several versions so if interested be sure and check the  
version to cover you.


*Rocky T. Squirrel, esq.

*

On 12/1/2017 1:42 AM, E D wrote:
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    <p><font face="Arial">widely used item in our area for alarm
        cellular xmiters without an external antenna..<br>
      </font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.zboost.com /">http://www.zboost.com /</a></font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">item comes in several versions so if interested
        be sure and check the version to cover you.</font></p>
    <div class="moz-signature"><br>
      <b>Rocky T. Squirrel, esq.<br>
        <br>
      </b> <br>
      <br>
    </div>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/1/2017 1:42 AM, E D wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:51b03336-461b-447d-b5b3-a6b5a45852d1@googlegroups.com">
      <pre wrap="">Hi Jim,

From all the customers that I have come across that do use those devices, it appears that they are just routing your calls thru the internet and in essence, somewhat like a VoIP line.

The devices used to be freely given to customers who were access challenged.. Now, they are charging customers close to $200 for the device. The customers went from being 'access challenged' to 'squeezed victims'. Usually, the cellular company is the only one in the area, and knows that they have a monopoly. Therefore, they can charge and know that most customers will end up paying.

Unlike a VoIP device that allows you to call anyone from any internet connection in the country, the booster device has to be tagged to your cellular service account. Therefore, trying to use a booster for an alarm cellular radio would not be unabled for that commercial unit. It is somewhat related to how your cellphone works. All cellular radios for consumers use access point names, which route your calls, text, and pictures in different ways thru the internet. I learned about 4 years ago to have different access point names/parameters in my cellphone. Depending on what area I may be in, I can quickly switch my access point name and get better service for my cellphone calls. It does take time to know what works where, thru trial and error. I have been with GSM phones for quite a while now, and this is what works best for me. Since I am using Sim Cards in my phones, I would not know if this would work on the CDMA systems.

Cell phone connections thru the towers can be routed any which way they want. It is all internet connections, whether thru wires or tower waves. In emergencies, they have the ability to route calls from one area to any other area. The towers throughout the USA are basically electrical connection 'wires' that can be made to connect to any other connection. Picture the old switchboard operators who used to pull one wire out and connect it to another jack to make a phone connection.

Earlier in the year, we did have a customer who had sporadic telco service way up on a mountain. The Lodge was for the residents of the area, and the homeowners association had an ATT commercial modem, basically creating an internet connection in a special cellular box with about 20' of cable length and antenna at the end. That unit put out an internet connection that was then hooked up to a router. The router put out wifi for the guests as well as wired ports. One port was then hooked up to an Ip card for the security system to communicate with.

It was a clean and ideal connection with little cost to the customer. In essence, it was a cellular radio allowing any internet connection to it.
  
We use both ATT and Verizon radios for alarm system connections depending on which service is better or preferable.

Perhaps others have more relevant information to come.

Have a great day.
</pre>
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  </body>
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Re: Cellular Radio.
On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 7:59:05 AM UTC-5, RTS wrote:
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Hi Rocky, This looks interesting. Their web site specifically says it can be used with alarm systems.  

I'll have to give them a call to get the details

Thanks

Re: Cellular Radio.
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Jim,

we use the Napco system your referencing..

to route old work wiring, I tend to look for sewer pipe venting ( the  
vertical run to attic)

then from attic locate the pipe and attempt a string drop (fishing  
weight on string)

some time a heater venting vertical run can also provide a wire pull  
chamber.

All else fail surface a wire run in conduit to the attic.

point is you want the cell unit or booster as high in the building as  
possible..

a directional antenna will also help..

The biggest problem we've had here in Kentucky USA

is not all cell towers support the "EBridge" service needed to make the  
2-way

feature work..

And that can be a real "Bitch" after spending several hours running  
wire..  ;-)


*Rocky T. Squirrel, esq.

*

On 12/1/2017 7:09 PM, Jim Davis wrote:
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    <p><font face="Arial">Jim,  <br>
      </font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">we use the Napco system your referencing..</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">to route old work wiring, I tend to look for
        sewer pipe venting ( the vertical run to attic)</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">then from attic locate the pipe and attempt a
        string drop (fishing weight on string)</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">some time a heater venting vertical run can
        also provide a wire pull chamber.</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">All else fail surface a wire run in conduit to
        the attic.</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">point is you want the cell unit or booster as
        high in the building as possible..</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">a directional antenna will also help..</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">The biggest problem we've had here in Kentucky
        USA  <br>
      </font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">is not all cell towers support the "EBridge"
        service needed to make the 2-way<br>
      </font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">feature work..</font></p>
    <p><font face="Arial">And that can be a real "Bitch" after spending
        several hours running wire..  ;-)<br>
      </font></p>
    <div class="moz-signature"><br>
      <b>Rocky T. Squirrel, esq.<br>
        <br>
      </b> <br>
      <br>
    </div>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/1/2017 7:09 PM, Jim Davis wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:8750d2d5-c8ab-4571-a30d-be9c37aa40e0@googlegroups.com">
      <pre wrap="">On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 7:59:05 AM UTC-5, RTS wrote:
</pre>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <pre wrap="">widely used item in our area for alarm
        cellular xmiters without an external antenna..

      
    
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.zboost.com /">http://www.zboost.com /</a>
    
item comes in several versions so if interested
        be sure and check the version to cover you.
    


      Rocky T. Squirrel, esq.

</pre>
      </blockquote>
      <pre wrap="">

Hi Rocky, This looks interesting. Their web site specifically says it can be used with alarm systems.  

I'll have to give them a call to get the details

Thanks
</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>

--------------1ECB780283B8C79ADCA6CCE3--

Re: Cellular Radio.
On Saturday, December 2, 2017 at 7:13:46 AM UTC-5, RTS wrote:

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Hi Rocky,

Yeah .... the "ol vent pipe trick " doesn't work on the newer homes nowdays
.
with the advent of using PVC for venting, they run the vent pipe all over t
he place with bends and elbows. Never a straight run anymore. Same goes for
 HVAC. Much of that is flex tubing. The returns are the best option but aga
in, with the newer homes using the "open" living spaces, there are hardly a
ny walls over walls or closets over closets. And, as I said, in this house  
every thing is over built with a first floor with radiant heat, made of cem
ent over the basement.

Metal pipe would have to be done outside, ( I don't do metal pipe) so I'd h
ave to get an electrician and the house is made of cement and field stone.

Haven't had any problems with the Starlink when cellular signal is availabl
e. I'm on Long Island NY ..... highly populated compared to you so I've fig
uring the cellular service is probably more robust here.

Re: Cellular Radio.
On 11/30/2017 10:03 PM, Jim Davis wrote:
 > Both Verizon and ATT provide Cellular "Boosters" for customer who use  
their cellular service but can't get a good signal in their home. I'm  
thinking that they are just providing a connection between the customers  
cell phone and the LAN to obtain VoIP telephone service. But I'm  
thinking it may be something more than that because I think if you turn  
off the WiFi on your cell phone you can still get on the Internet.
 >   Does anyone know if a Cellular alarm radio can use this "Booster"  
to transmit signals to central station?
 >

Actual cellular boosters are available.  I have one on my shop so I  
don't have to go outside to make and receive calls.  My cell actually  
works better inside (before the booster) if I turned wiFi VOIP  
redundancy off on my phone.  Doesn't seem to be an option with my new  
phone.  I also have a VOIP phone ap installed on my phone so I can use  
my MagicJack account from my phone anywhere in the shop if I want to.  
Not that I have an issue with air time.  The Magic Jack number is just  
the phone number I use for CNC Molds N Stuff.

For your cellular alarm communicator you can get sims for different  
carriers depending on the vendor.  Sometimes you may need to order a  
different unit if CDMA is best (Verizon usually). Use which ever has the  
best signal strength in the area, (Out west its almost always Verizon)  
and then the next step is to install a high gain antenna in a nonvisible  
(from the ground) outdoor antenna on your cellular communicator.  
Sometimes using the high gain antenna was enough even indoors.  Heck  
sometimes even in the attic is great.  I've even installed directional  
beam VHF antennas in attics with good results too.

That being said the other vendors have all been improving their  
coverage.  (Except maybe AT&T)  They can't compete on price if they  
can't cover the clients needs.


Re: Cellular Radio.
On Friday, December 1, 2017 at 2:08:06 PM UTC-5, Bob La Londe wrote:
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Yeah I can get cellular radios for various carriers but there's hardly any  
signal at all in the area. The electrician has and Android with ATT and no  
signal at all.  I have Verizon Iphone and I was able to get text message bu
t calls were spotty. Had to go outside to stay connected. So obviously ther
e's some signal there. But the alarm panel is on the first floor in a close
t in the middle of the house (this is a takeover ) and this house was built
 by the owner who is in the transit mix cement and mason business. It's lik
e a stone fortress. Getting to the out side or to the second floor or attic
 with a wire, is probably not going to happen. The floor between the first  
floor and basement is made of concrete with radiant heating.  

Customer wants remote control of alarm system and I've been using cellular  
(Napco Starlink) to do that.  

I was pretty sure the "Boosters" that the phone companies provided where ju
st converting phone calls to VoIP via the LAN but wanted to be sure.



Re: Cellular Radio.

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There are two types of "booster." One type uses two boxes. One placed where
there is a signal available, the other inside where there is no signal
currently. Think of this as a repeater type.

The other is a pico cell tower that plugs into a broadband connection and
connects to the cellco through the internet.

Both have their uses, just depends on the problem you are trying to solve.

Re: Cellular Radio.
On Saturday, December 2, 2017 at 12:42:47 AM UTC-5, Arthur Conan Doyle wrote:
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Yes, Rocky recommended this  http://www.zboost.com/

which I'll be contacting them on Monday.  

I'm hoping that if I get one of these that I can get a wire between the attic and somewhere near the first floor.

We'll see.

Re: Cellular Radio.
On Saturday, December 2, 2017 at 3:13:45 PM UTC-5, Jim Davis wrote:
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ote:
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here
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ve.
ttic and somewhere near the first floor.
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So OK
Found out that there are DIY boosters and professional Boosters.  
Wilson seems to be the name that comes up more often as being the better pr
oduct. Obviously a little more expensive.  

For those not familiar with how it works .... there's an outside antenna co
nnected to an inside booster module and then an inside antenna. The outside
 antenna most recommended is a directional. They are higher gain and since  
most cellular service providers usually transmit from the same tower or are
a a directional will usually pick up any provider. You can split the output
 of the booster to more than one inside antenna but it is advisable to keep
 the total length of coax to less than 100 feet. The ideal way to find the  
proper place for the external antenna is that it usually should be high up  
on the building. To find the right spot ..... get out your extension ladder
 and your Android phone and check the signal strength at various mounting l
ocations around the building. As a guide, they say that two bars on a stand
ard cell phone out side the building may or may not be strong enough to be  
able to be boosted. So two bars or better seems to be the goal.            
                                                                            
            
If you have an android cell phone there is an app that will allow you to de
termine how good a signal you are getting outside of the house. go to Play  
Store and download "Open Signal" or " Signal Check ". IPhone doesn't have a
n app to check signal.
                                                                            
      
The lower the input signal is the lower the output signal will be so it's w
orth trying to find the best spot to locate the outside antenna. Directiona
l antennas are harder to install too.                                      
                                       Systems are purchased based on the s
quare footage of the area you want to cover inside the building. They range
 in price accordingly.

WillsonAmplifiers.com is the distributor for Wilson products. Don't be misl
ed by some of the cheaper items you may see on line.

That should be enough to get you going. You'll have to do the nitty gritty  
research.  

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