Casement Windows

I have mostly double-hung windows. They are currently able to remain open a few inches and still have the system armed. Now we are adding a couple of casement windows. Is there any way to wire them and allow them to remain open a few inches on a nice day? Thanks!

Reply to
FondOfBooks
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Not really. Your best bet is to have your screens wired as security screens. Either being cut or removed activates the alarm and since casement windows have interior screens, they will last along time, since they are not in the weather. Actually a better choice for security than venting windows and you will gain protection from anyone coming through the glass. You don't have to do all of them, but a couple for cross ventilation is nice.

Reply to
Bob Worthy

FondOfBooks wrote:

Here's something you may want to try. I don't do it all the time, only if the client REAAALLLLLLY wants to ventilate a casement or two on an install.

First, the switch and magnet have to be installed on the hinge side of the window. The magnet, in relation to the switch has to be mounted so that the window can only be opened about two to three inches (depending upon the make of the window) before the switch breaks contact. If you let it open any more than that, someone could reach in and mess with the switch. Then, at that point of the window being open, install a hook and eye somewhere on the frame and moving part of the window so that the window can only open so far. You need to do this because sometimes, when the wind blows a casement window, it can gradually open over a period of time. It doesn't look to pretty if the window is in a obvious place and it's not too convenient if you're opening and closing the window every day ( because you have to take the screen off each time you want to use the hook and eye). In a couple of cases, I installed a short chain between the frame and the window, so they wouldn't have to remove the screen each time. The chain unhoods, in case they ever had to open the window all the way. But all in all, the easiest, but more expensive way to do it, is with security screens. I just don't like screens because they can be slit and someone can reach in and mess with the wires, if they know what they're doing. And if you have screens in a room, people tend to leave the windows WIDE open and so you can't have a motion detector in that room which could trip due to wind blowing something around, while the windows are open.

If you're doing this yourself, this make work for you.

I usually don't post this kind of stuff in this group, because there's someone by the name of Robert Bass here, who likes to steal this kind of information and claim that he thought of it. He uses information like this to make money on his web site. You know the kind, a thieving lying scumbag who gets by using other people.

Reply to
Jim

I have had screens made with an integral eol resistor for just this reason. js

Reply to
alarman

That would be good if there was only one casement window on each zone or someone just happened to pick the one window, in the zone, that had the resistor in it. I think that most people (including me) don't put one (casement) window on a zone. I usually put a room ( if there's only a few windows in the room) on a zone. And the "messing with the wires" I'm talking about are not the wires imbeded in the screen, I'm talking about the wires going to the plug or whatever, that connects to the screen. I once had a system bypassed by someone doing this to the screened window in the in the master bath room. Thankfully I had a motion detector in the adjoining master bedroom. It was done by a neighbors kid who thought he knew the system.

I guess if a client started out during the estimate stage, insisting that they be able to ventilate their casement windows, each window could be wired seperately, but that would add even more to the price and make it that much more of a detriment to the sale. If they were willing to pay the price, then .... why not. But, here in the northeast, it's always too much to pay just to leave the windows open for a few weeks out of the year.

And, obviously, if it's a wireless system, eol doesn't come into it at all.

Reply to
Jim

If the resistor goes missing doesn't matter if there's one screen or 10 on the loop.

| > > I just don't like screens because they can be slit and someone can reach | > > in and mess with the wires, if they know what they're doing. | >

| > I have had screens made with an integral eol resistor for just this reason. | > js | | That would be good if there was only one casement window on each zone | or someone just happened to pick the one window, in the zone, that had | the resistor in it. I think that most people (including me) don't put | one (casement) window on a zone. I usually put a room ( if there's only | a few windows in the room) on a zone. And the "messing with the wires" | I'm talking about are not the wires imbeded in the screen, I'm talking | about the wires going to the plug or whatever, that connects to the | screen. I once had a system bypassed by someone doing this to the | screened window in the in the master bath room. Thankfully I had a | motion detector in the adjoining master bedroom. It was done by a | neighbors kid who thought he knew the system. | | I guess if a client started out during the estimate stage, insisting | that they be able to ventilate their casement windows, each window | could be wired seperately, but that would add even more to the price | and make it that much more of a detriment to the sale. If they were | willing to pay the price, then .... why not. But, here in the | northeast, it's always too much to pay just to leave the windows open | for a few weeks out of the year. | | And, obviously, if it's a wireless system, eol doesn't come into it at | all. |

Reply to
Crash Gordon

Way too much work trying vent a casement...bad enough it's a casement to begin with!

Reply to
Crash Gordon

I put multiple windows in the same room on the same zone, but not when I use alarm screens anymore. If the customer is willing to pay for the screens, a zone expander or two is a drop in the bucket. Now screens are alone on a zone, and I don't have to sweat the tamper threat. We leave windows open a lot down here. You're right about the wireless though, the eol only works for h/w unless you're using a xmtr with eol capability. The ones I use don't. js

Reply to
alarman

But if you short the circuit at the screen lead, and the resistor is in another location, the zone thinks the screen is still there and the resistor is still present. js

Reply to
alarman

The downside to building the EOLR into the screen is that it complicates troubleshooting. When you meter the resistance in an EOL screen, you might have a reading of 1050 ohms. Is it good or bad? Who knows, due to the tolerance of the resistor. On the other hand, if you meter a small non-EOL screen and you read 50 ohms, you know the screen is bad.

Granted, if you have only one screen per zone, you've narrowed down the problem somewhat. :-)

There's also the risk that when you update the system in ten years, the EOLs will be the wrong value for new panel you wanted to use.

- badenov

Reply to
Nomen Nescio

how would you get at the screen lead...don't you slot the frames?...we don't leave the leads out, although the cleaning lady might

Reply to
Crash Gordon

It depends on the application. Mostly I slot the frame, but the leads are almost always exposed the first time someone removes the screen for cleaning. js

Reply to
alarman

Slotting the frames may make everything look neater, but it's very user-unfriendly. Sometimes, it's difficult for an installer to get the wire to go back down the hole, and for the average consumer or painter, it's pretty much impossible.

I've also noticed that when people order slotted frames, they generally don't think to order a second tamper switch at the lead end of the screen. In which case, an exposed lead looks high security by comparison.

- badenov

Reply to
Nomen Nescio

Nope.

If there are multiple windows on a loop and there's an EOL at the last window. Each window has a two wire drop to the basement/attic. Short out those two wires and the EOL is still in the loop. Screens don't typically have four wires to carry both sides of the loop.

I think the case was posted here awhile ago, where in just such an installation, an installer had bypassed bedroom windows while the screens were being repaired and a woman was murdered because the intruder just happend to pick the bypassed windows. EOL was at the last window. Installer just bypassed the two wires going to the removed screen.

Reply to
Jim

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