X10 Question

Well, I'm probably talking to myself here, but here goes. I did some testing around the house. There seemed to be multiple problems. I noticed the green LED on the 1132CU was off at times, or very dim. This is indicative of an x10 signal coming in or some noise. It should normally stay on and only blink out when there is x10 traffic. This morning I noticed the green LED on the 1132CU was out. My 1st thought was to replace the 1132 ... I have a spare. Same thing with the new one. So, next I turned off the repeater in the breaker box. Same thing, only now some things couldn't be controlled ... but this is expected. Next I noticed an LED flood on the range hood was on, so I turned it off. Bingo! No more noise, the green LED on the 1132CU was now on steady. These LED flood lights are brand new. Got them at Amazon. They are miniature floods, PAR16 with a standard medium base. I guess they're going back. I'm sure they don't pass FCC requirements for emissions on the power line. I know FCC regs for conducted emissions on the mains, are less stringent than in Europe, but this is totally nuts.

But, after all the testing, I still think there is something wrong with the 2 PowerFlash modules. I had one set up on the workbench and shorted the terminals with a pair of long nose pliers, which should send the signal. Absolutely no x10 output. I hit the test button ... same results. AND, the above mentioned LED floods were not on at the time. Now, that same module seems to be working again. Lots of weirdnesses.

Sounds like noise to me. All my frustrating X10 problems over the decades have been due to noise, either on the powerline or RF.

Some devices will pollute the power line X10 signal. Compact fluorescent bulbs, or tube fluorescent. Computers and peripherals.

Other devices will overwhelm the X10 RF signal with noise. I have a Homedics chair massager that disables my RF X10 motion sensors.

The first thing to do is turn off your entire house and test the questionable X10 modules (while hoping your neighbor isn't sending X10 noise to you). If the module(s) work reliably, you have a noise problem. Start buying X10 filters to filter out the noise.

I was lucky enough to buy an ELK ESM1 X10 signal meter cheaply years back when they were still made. It's been invaluable to me to track down noise. You may have to put out some significant $$$ to get a noise meter now, eg:

Other useful links:

Yeah, now I'm gun shy. Although, I do have other LED light bulbs around, and a lot of CFLs, too. I have some mini LED floods which are supposed to be 35 watt equiv and they never have caused problems. These 50w equiv minis, just killed power line stuff in my house. As I said, I will try to return them. There is another product which I will try next.

I only have a couple LED bulbs, and found them to be noisy, so I have them behind a filter.

Compact fluorescent are all over my house and have caused me X10 problems for years. Then I found GREENLITE compact fluorescent bulbs. They are a godsend. That's all I will use now -- they are not X10 noise monsters (google "X10 greenlite" and read a bit).

But to repeat, you have to convince yourself that noise is the cause of your problems before spending $$$ to filter it and/or replace offending equipment.

Turn everything else off and test only the X10 hardware that is malfunctioning. If it starts working reliably, turn everything back on. If X10 starts failing... well, you've probably got a noise problem.

I've found X10 devices to be remarkably reliable, and long-lived (decades). The plastic will yellow and they continue chugging along. Time does not seem to effect their sensitivity. I have dozens of X10 devices, and the only time they've caused me grief is due to noise from other hardware.

This one is starting at $25 on eBay:

If that goes for more than you want to pay, I suggest setting up an eBay watch on: ELK ESM1

Good luck,

Don.

I stopped using X-10 stuff when I moved to a 123 year old house. It was built before electricity was in the neighborhood. Circuits go all over the place. I tried once and gave up.

In 1988 I renovated a loft and it was all X-10. I was having modules go bad after a few years. The electrolytic capacitors used were cheap and failing. The modules would then chatter.

I gave away all my left over controllers. Or so I thought. I recently came upon four wall switch modules. Three Levitons from 1988. And one more recent from Smarthome. New in original boxes. I need to get them on Craig's List for free.

I'm in Brooklyn, if someone wants to swing by and pick them up.

Don.

Unfortunately the group died when Robert Bass died.

Don.

Ah, thank you Don for jarring a fading memory. I have had (rarely) appliance modules go bad -- the "chattering" effect you describe. But not for years, and I have thirty appliance modules now in use. Maybe once you've found a X10 module with decent caps you're good to go.

Never had a palm pad (use a half dozen) or tabletop mini controller or infrared sensor go south.

Have a WGLDesigns V572 paired with an XTB-523 to make the RF happen. A PSC05 worked fine too; I got the XTB-523 just because I find Jeff Volp's products to be amazing in general.

Haven't used lamp wall modules or the dimming button switches so I can't comment on them. I do have a universal module PUM01 controlling a thermostat; it's lasted forever. And of course I've a device to carry the signal across my two wiring legs.

Everything works with amazing reliability once the noise issue is understood and defeated. Perhaps living in California with low humidity and mild climate has extended the life of my X10 devices.

Oh boy, speaking of a failing memory... I forgot I have modified all my appliance modules -- clipped the diode -- to disable local control. I always disliked that "current sensing" feature. eg:

Maybe that's what's keep>

This now being 25 years ago I don't recall the details. They were very likely appliance modules. I doubt they were lamp modules. Maybe they just had a bad batch back then.

Neither did I. I bet controllers and sensors don't have electrolytic capacitors.

Don.

Hi Paul,

I found your aquarium page. I think salt water fish are neat. I once created this page:

But no way would I have them. No way would I be able to keep it going. I once had a dream of having fish and forgetting to feed them.

Don.

Too bad, there used to be lots of good information here. BTW, I have converted several lamp modules to silent appliance modules; some using a solid state relay (5A) and others using the triac (3A). They seem to work really well.

My original problem with the PowerFlash module is temporarily solve. Originally, the PF module was in the garage where it got its signal from IR detector across the driveway. PIR units false trigger from everything including wind, deer, bears and dogs. This unit has a source on one side and a detector on the other. Anyway, when it triggers, it sends an X10 signal via the PF module, which is decoded by an 1132CU, as I said previously. Now, I have the PF module in the basement with a temporary wire from the garage to the basement. This works pretty good, but I do want to make it more "permanent". I think a Volp repeater/coupler might be in my future as I think the X10 unit I have now might have some issues. I am in a pretty low noise environment where there are few houses on pretty large lots. Noise in my house is usually made in my house from things like the aforementioned LED flood light. BTW, I returned them and ordered a different brand. I'm holing my breathe.