The things I did not like about the x10 system were:
poor reliability of 3 way switches delay no soft on
Has x10 resolved these issues or is there a better system out there?
Thanks Chris
The things I did not like about the x10 system were:
poor reliability of 3 way switches delay no soft on
Has x10 resolved these issues or is there a better system out there?
Thanks Chris
Depends on what you mean by solved, it's better than it was 8 years ago.
The devices are better and support more features (like soft on), have a higher reliability, and better signal detection.
There are a number of new devices to enhance reliability too (signal repeaters, boosters, two way communication).
There are also a number of new systems, but none of them have the range of devices, support, and low cost of X-10.
That being said, the major players in the enthusiast category: UPB, Z-Wave, and Insteon all have their pros and cons (and I would consider all of them better than X-10).
There is no clear best choice (every system seems to have some major drawbacks), but I am rather liking Insteon due to its very good backwards compatibility with X-10 (it's like icing on the cake that the others don't support) (but Insteon doesn't support 3-phase and there have been so many device firmware updates it would suck to be one of the first adopters).
I like the Insteon stuff myself. X10 is 30+ year old technology and has survived only because nothing better was available in the price category. Insteon solves that. I'm converting now and so far all is working very well.
From:Chris snipped-for-privacy@oberholzer.us
Insteon probably has this solved, with the enrollment and ACK/NAk part of the protocol
Insteon is shorter. Insteon speed is about 2K bps (worse case) vs 60 bps for X10.
Smarthome has this for X10 and Insteon. Insteon is sold by Smarthome and I'd venture a guess that the X10 and Insteon prices are the same for the products with that feature.
Overall I agree with Bruce.
As for 3-phase, it's apparent that Insteon is planning on selling in Europe at some point (some oblique references to European RF frequencies in some of the documentation make this clear). While that may not necessitate support for 3-phase, it's more likely they will see some demand for 3-phase support there.
Meanwhile, you might be able to use it >Depends on what you mean by solved, it's better than it was 8 years ago. >
One RF Linc per phase should work. The Insteon packets are 1823µS duration so three at 120° intervals or 5557µS apart will not overlap even if there is incidental coupling over the wiring.
Smarthome states that Insteon is not 3-phase compatible.
So who are you going to believe - me or the people who invented it?
I don't see any difficulties with standard messages. Insteon doesn't rely on a traditional PLC phase coupler. The RF Lincs can receive RF asynchronously and automatically resync with the local ZC when they resend it as PLC.
However, extended RF messages are 5625µS long which is 69µS longer than 1/3 of a 60Hz powerline cycle. There will be collisions between the RF from the various phases if they are sending extended messages.
Dave you do realize that is the URL were X10's and you ask that question it would be retorical. ;-)
^^^^^ Sorry that's would not be retorical.
On Sun, 29 Jan 2006 22:04:22 GMT, "Chris" posted:
The LM14A should give you the soft on you are looking for! It's real sweet!!!
Interesting, this makes it dead and unusable over here in Switzerland. Even my small single bedroom apartment used 2 separate phases for the two lighting circuits...
Markus
It will handle 2 phases fine just not 3 phase which is generally only found in larger industrial locations.
From:Markus Baertschi snipped-for-privacy@markus.org
Well, it'll handle split phase 120V/240V, this is still considered single phase, and is not two phase.
Yes, that's right, in the US we use "split single phase" service which, at the meter, is delivered as two 180 degree legs out of phase by 180 degrees. So, if you have two 60 Hz 120v phases 180 degrees apart these will work. That is NOT the same as two phases of 3 phase service which would only be 120 degrees apart.
From:none snipped-for-privacy@nospam.com
SmartHome does have plans for Europe, and I hope it includes more than just the UK (which from what I've read also uses single phase extensively).
Insteon is so incredibly superior to X-10, that it really would be worth waiting for.
Thanks to everyone for your feedback.
Is there a controller for insteon that has more that 5 switches? Or can you use the x10 controller? Has smarthome given any idea when additional items will be available?
Yes, the KeypadLinc V2 supports either 6 or 8 buttons (configurable).
SmartHome released several new Insteon items, but I've never seen a schedule or definitive list. There are many rumored devices, but only SmartHome knows when they'll actually release them...
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