i've recently put some 100w fluorescent bulbs in my bedside lamps and switched the x10 'lamp' module to a 'machinery' module ...and i can turn the lamps off with the remote - then they flicker for a few minutes and then turn on again! i have other lamps around the house where this is not a problem. i do have an inexpensive switch mechanism in the lamps (i took some vases and made them into lamps) ...could that be the problem?
tia ... steve
Nope - it's the newer CFL lightbulbs. They are able to relight themselves via the trickle current used by the module to sense when someone jiggles the local on switch (aka local control).
Two ways out: Put a small nightlight or other load on the module along with the CFL to absorb the trickle current or look up:
"X10 appliance mod local control current sense diode snip"
in Google . . .
(oh, heck, here it is:)
Downside is that either method makes it impossible to turn on the lamp by using the lamp's built-in switch. May or may not be a problem for you.
I found that using the power supply to my Creative PC speakers worked nicely to suppress the lamp's relighting although I'd really like the CHA gurus to figure out a way to do it without sacrificing local control. Certain fixtures and bulbs don't suffer from the problem but my experience indicates that more and more fluorescents fixtures of both the 48" striplite and the spiral CFL kind are likely to relight themselves. :-(
IIRC, I read where someone had taken a module apart, stuck it in the lamp, did the diode snip and then wired a pushbutton style lamp switch on the lamp itself so that it triggered the module via the low voltage circuitry.
That way you have local control, but the lamp doesn't come back on by itself because the current sensing diode is snipped. Don't ask we *where* you tie the lamp switch in on the module or where I read it. The last time CFL's flashing back on bothered me I did a Google search and vaguely remember seeing the details. I think you tie in where the X-10 three-way traveler normally connects but again, you need to search to be sure.
-- Bobby G.
thanks ...that seems to be spot on ... strange that this doesn't happen with other lamps but it may be because i'm using 50-100-150 bulbs in them and they already have a 'trickle' current absorber ...
i may just use the mechanical switch on the lamp, as it is next to the bedside :-) ...
do any of the other remote systems - z whatever for example, work better?
thanks aga>[re: CFL lamps turning themselves back on after a few seconds]
Compact fluorescent lamps (CFLs) have sophisticated electronics built into their bases that interact (badly) with X-10 control circuitry. Ironically the brand new GE CFL bulbs I bought last week from Wal-mart exhibit an annoying number of bright flashes after they've been turned off remotely. The batch I bought two months ago behaved just fine. Obviously, the lamp designs are still evolving.
Then go for it. CFL's and X-10 do not mix well. X-10'ers should probably be barraging lamp manufacturers to address the problem. When I return these bulbs, I'll hopefully be casting a vote for X-10 friendliness.
Work differently. Better is in the eye of the beholder. If a remote system doesn't interact with the load, the chances are greater that it will tolerate CFL bulbs without incident. X-10 has so much trouble with fluorescents because it's trying to be "helpful" in sensing whether anyone's jiggled the lamp's built-in switch. It was a great idea when the world was lit with mostly incandescent lamps. Still, I'd rather have the option. X-10 modules need a "local sense ON/OFF" slide switch to help cope with the CFL issue.
Good luck!
-- Bobby G.
I have found 'Globe' (globe-electric.com) brand CFLs work really well with X10.
They don't have the problem with the annoying flicker when turned off, they don't automatically come back on again, and they even have one that is dimmable and it works well with the X10 lamp modules.
Jeff
okey dokey i'll order some from then ...
thanks! :-) ...
steve
I was just going to ask about this. I'm surprised after all this time, that they haven't built a better CFL bulb.
I've got one socket rocket that has not worked for almost a year, but I've been too lazy to do any serious investigation. Although I'm pretty sure it's the CFLs in the outside lights. Changing brands did not solve the problem. The last couple of nights the lights on one aquarium would not go off, so I've been turning them off with the remote when I go to bed. But tonight this did not work. After a little head scratching I realized that the CFL table lamp was still turned on. Turing off this lamp solved the problem. The strange thing is that this lamp did not bother the aquarium lights in the past! Do these things generate more noise with age?
It's not tht they generate noise, it's that they suck the X-10 signal down to nothingness. There's usually a big ol' capacitor right across the line in each CFL to keep noise off the line. Of course this attenuates any X-10 signals that happen to be present.
dickm
I think they are trying but they are optimizing for qualities that are not X-10 friendly. I assume each new generation of CFLs produces a little more light per watt than the last and costs a little bit less to make. I also think that they are trying to reduce the noise which leads them to put capacitors across the AC line and do all sorts of other things that kill noise - and to a lighting engineer, X-10 is noise.
Our houses are really very dynamic when it comes to the wiring "network." It took a long time for me to figure out that the occasional noise I was seeing in one area only occured when the UPS was in its charge cycle. Anything nearby like a power supply for a laptop or a UPS could cause the signal to degrade.
-- Bobby G.
They generate both noise and "suckiness" if my Monterey is to be believed. About 50mV seems to be standard.
From what I can determine, the CFL *may* not absorb the X-10 signal to the extent that it won't turn on, but once it's turned on, the bulb generates local noise equivalent to the strength of the now severely attentuated X-10 signal and the X-10 switch controlling it goes "deaf" - at least to signals from far away.
Their are two clues that point to this being the case. One is that the bulb switches on, but not off, remotely. The second is that bulb may turn off remotely if the controller is very close to the load and putting out enough voltage to overcome both the CFL's "suck" factor and noise output.
-- Bobby G.
We had one CF light that would miss its off signal maybe once a month. But it has not missed since the first XTB prototype was brought on line back in April.
An inexpensive fix that has always worked for me is to add a Miller 5252 125 mH hash choke in the hot lead somewhere between the plug and the bulb. Often there is room in the base of the lamp. Be sure to insulate well with shrink sleeving. It's rated 3.5A, so there is no concern about replacing the CF with an incandescent in the future.
Jeff
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